just wondering

im growin in a 2x4 closet I have bout 2inches both sides so im using all the light it gives out plus going flower wit it jus to see wat the difference is its all personal smoke anyways.....

The Hemp Goddess said:

The T5s put out the same (or slightly more) lumens per watt as a MH, unlike other fluoro tubes. In addition to being able to put the light within an inch or so of the plants, like Roddy mentioned, it also spreads the light more evenly and runs cooler. I believe that both of these factors contribute to the tight internodal spacing.

BWD--just for your information. Fluoro tubes come in T12, T8, and T5. The number behind the T denotes the diameter of the tube in 8ths of an inch--T12s are 12/8th or 1-1/2", T8s are 8/8" or 1", T5s are 5/8".

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oh i think i misunderstood, i thought he was saying that at each node there were more actual branches, like the ones that happen once the first ones are established. that they formed earlier;

"new branches between the nodes they start coming out really early"

just i veg with some 24 watt t5s thought i might be missing out on something the higher powered ones did.
cheers anyway.

I have a slight difference of opinion on the reason T5s are bette than the MH. Its mostly conjecture so I may be "full of it", But from what I have read and from my own experimentation, the spectrum of the light plays a very important part (not to say that even coverage and light despersal don't have any effect).

The metal Halide puts out light at around 5100k which is in the middle of the visible spectral block. This light has a lot of green light in it, as well as other colors, but plants with strong green leaves will not use much of the green light if any. Not only is that wasted energy, it doesn't serve the plants. The other colors present in the MH light (from my experiment) seemed to help the plants grow massive root balls, as compaired to the same 3 strains grown under T5s(which put out a tighter band around 6500k), but the lack of light energy caused the plants under the MH to stretch considerably.

I think the 6500k light has a lot more light energy in the lumens emitted because of the tighter wavelength, plus the colors within this light are well absorbed by the chlorophyll in the plants' leaves. I believe the combination of these 2 things(combined with the better, even coverage) enables the plant to achieve better vegetative growth without the stretch.

I would venture to say that while I haven't tested it and have only conjecture to go on, I believe the combination of high output T5s and lower power(250w) metal halide would give really great growth rates while in veg, allowing someone who needs plants to be upwards of 3' tall before flipping to flowering, to achieve this in a much shorter time period. Again this is only conjecture, but I did it once before and did see phenominal growth rates. The problem with this is that for most of us who are growing inside, the larger growth isn't desired, and the energy usage would not be cost efficient.

Great read, THANKS HP!

I think it is all about the amount of lumens the gardener can get to the plant. Due to the heat of a mH many growers cannot achieve the same amount of lumens at that distance as a t-5 veg can. It all about lumens.

The metal Halide puts out light at around 5100k which is in the middle of the visible spectral block. This light has a lot of green light in it, as well as other colors, but plants with strong green leaves will not use much of the green light if any. Not only is that wasted energy, it doesn't serve the plants. The other colors present in the MH light (from my experiment) seemed to help the plants grow massive root balls, as compaired to the same 3 strains grown under T5s(which put out a tighter band around 6500k), but the lack of light energy caused the plants under the MH to stretch considerably.

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They make mH in the 6500K:confused2:

Eye Lighting 250 Watt 6500K 90 CRI Full Spectrum universal metal halide lamp...plantlightinghydroponics.com/eye-250w-6500k-full-spectrum-universal-metal-halide-bulb-p-92.html

plantlightinghydroponics.com/eye-400w-6500k-full-spectrum-horizontal-metal-halide-bulb-p-93.html

So I do not understand your reasoning Hushpuppy:confused2: on the t-5s
If both are 6500k and the same amount of lumens striking the plant canopy, they should grow the same. No matter if they are t-5's or mH or am I miss understanding this?

mountain man said:

You are ridiculous....

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I stepped away from yur fire out of respect for yu partner and promised not to set yur fire gain. I provide comfort at my fireside actualy command it as well as bein polite. I trust ifin yual dont like my firside then yual be man enough to set somewheres else and respect mine. I think I will let this rest at this pilgrem and keep walkin my trail straight forward and hopes I dont feel any more stick a pokin to me from you. Safe and happy trail Mr. Mountain Man I trust yual fine yur type elsewhere good luck your journey Sir.

BWD

Hey PC, I haven't seen the Metal in the 6500k spectrum before. Is that new or have I just missed them? Given that you can get them in that spectrum I would be interested to see if the metal will work as well as the T5 in similar situations. I agree that it is certainly about lumens, without a doubt. The experiment that I did in my grow was with the 5100k MH bulb.

Given this information I would agree with your last statement, "If both are 6500k and the same amount of lumens striking the plant canopy, they should grow the same. No matter if they are t-5's or mH or am I miss understanding this?" That is if my suppositions are correct about the growth improvements being attributed the color spectrum and energy within the frequency of the light-wave. I could be wrong

Now let's zero in on the flowering spectrum, invent some nice cool T5s that emit it,

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Dan K. They make t-5's already in the flowering spectrum, just not enough penetration.imo

plantlightinghydroponics.com/quantum-2900k-t5-fluorescent-grow-lamp-2pack-p-3515.html

We have had members use t-5's for flowering and they worked, just not as dense as HID lighting. I think Weedhopper was one that did a few grows with them, before switching to HID. But not 100% positive.

If both are 6500k and the same amount of lumens striking the plant canopy, they should grow the same. No matter if they are t-5's or mH or am I miss understanding this?

Costs are more for using the MH, it's hotter than T5's and cannot be put as close to the plants....these small differences are likely what make the T5 such a good choice for many of us! If all other things are equal, that is.

I like the t5 I have it bout 2inches above my plant I can feel some heat off of it I closed of my ac duct to the door opened with a small fan going. I bought the t5 for space and was in my price range and my electric bill went up only 10 bucks. im still looking for a flowering flouro by agrobrite. thanks all im learning alot

Roddy said:

If both are 6500k and the same amount of lumens striking the plant canopy, they should grow the same. No matter if they are t-5's or mH or am I miss understanding this?

Costs are more for using the MH, it's hotter than T5's and cannot be put as close to the plants....these small differences are likely what make the T5 such a good choice for many of us! If all other things are equal, that is.

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You have no idea what I was talking about.

But there again, nothing new!!

Sounds to me somethin I should be gettin, my room be cookin the last couple days with heat and humidity runnin 109! we just gettin some relief today drop down to bout 80 but room and mh light runnin without air condition this year cause Im packin camp. So I hope I make it the next 3 weeks of 100+ in the room. Good luck and hope yur trails walkin lead the way right by ya.

BWD

yeah I got lost and way out to left field on this still listen and learning bout the lumens and heat thing.i kno that im puting out 20k lumes in a 2x4 closet sounds rite as to that I can grow two plants with the t-5.

sidewayz said:

yeah I got lost and way out to left field on this still listen and learning bout the lumens and heat thing.i kno that im puting out 20k lumes in a 2x4 closet sounds rite as to that I can grow two plants with the t-5.

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If you are going to want to flower with the T5s, you are going to want to get tubes in the 3000K range for this. You really are also going to need more light--to be at 5000 lumens per sq ft, you are going to need 8 tubes that emit 5000 lumens each for adequate flowering in 8 sq ft.

Weedhopper had some real decent grows using T5s the whole way. He was adequately lit, though.

wow I got it now thats why everyone uses hps for flowering for the lumens. prety muc im not gona have tite buds just airy stragly buds. thanks thg

pcduck said:

You have no idea what I was talking about.

But there again, nothing new!!

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I understood just fine. An idea and suggestion, though, if you don't think I understood, explaining would go a long ways, surely much better than merely dismissing and slamming?

I sure hope you don't start this one into a battle, too.

sidewayz said:

I like the t5 I have it bout 2inches above my plant I can feel some heat off of it I closed of my ac duct to the door opened with a small fan going. I bought the t5 for space and was in my price range and my electric bill went up only 10 bucks. im still looking for a flowering flouro by agrobrite. thanks all im learning alot

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A HPS won't put the electric bill up much more and will really rock your plants!!

sidewayz said:

wow I got it now thats why everyone uses hps for flowering for the lumens. prety muc im not gona have tite buds just airy stragly buds. thanks thg

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If properly lit, you can get good results....but it'd take a lot of lights to do it with T5's and imho cost more.

Roddy said:

I understood just fine. An idea and suggestion, though, if you don't think I understood, explaining would go a long ways, surely much better than merely dismissing and slamming?

I sure hope you don't start this one into a battle, too.

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No you do not!! You do not understand the conversation I was having with Hushpuppy!! He seemed to understand what the conversation was about without me having to re-explain myself!!!

Why don't you read the posts before typing? The only battle there is, is you trying to act like you know how to grow and trying to convince everyone you do.

Play nice boys. Remember, this is Marijuana Passion. I have mad respect for both of you guys, would be a shame to loose one of you over something like miscommunication.

Drfting07