RSO from a spagyric elixir

Rosebud said:

Maybe we aren't talking about the same thing. I agree with your definition of cannabis oil. I also agree with you about RS not inventing this process. I also agree that oil can be smoked. I have and quite enjoyed it. But, and maybe this is the deal, none of the oil i have seen or smoked is anything like what i make. Maybe i make it wrong. I use everclear and cook it forever. The cost of what i make on the market would be prohibitive. At my figures it would be over a thousand dollars a syringe. I didn't pay that for my oil. Talk to me Multi.

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This is all spot on RB, of course rso oil that you made is different from anything else on the market. It is pure cannabis oil provided all of the alcohol has been evaporated off.

The differences lie in the preparation and delivery method as well as purities. RSO is the purest, provided everclear is used.

The whole point that RS used rubbing alcohol instead of food grade everclear proves he did not know everything. Neither do I however I am willing to learn more and share what I have found freely. There should be no cost attached to anything, especially knowledge and wisdom.

I have cbd oil in my fridge that I purchased and used to save my cats life. It is delivered via hemp seed oil and a dropper. You could not do that with rso.

They are both cannabis oils. CBD "hemp" oil is not rso.

BTW I appreciate the discussion.

Rick Simpson uses a Canadian form of Naptha. That scared me to death. I use everclear in that and 151 rum or glycerine in tinctures.

Rosebud said:

Rick Simpson uses a Canadian form of Naptha. That scared me to death. I use everclear in that and 151 rum or glycerine in tinctures.

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Yeah that does not sound good. I am sure that at one point he did use rubbing alcohol because my first oil was made with rubbing alcohol after having watched his video. I assume he has used many different solvents, everclear is not cheap.

Does the method I am proposing make a little more sense now Rosebud?

7. Take up that Salt and place it into the metal crucible. We are going to begin the Calcination process, during which Fire is applied to the Salts to refine them as much as possible. Using the Torch ( I recommend placing the metal crucible in a bowl filled with sand, so that excess heat is dispersed safely), burn the Salts until they are dry, black, and charred. Use tongs to lift the crucible, and pour the black Salts into the Mortar. Grind them down into a fine black ash with the pestle, and then return them to the crucible. Burn the Salts again, heating them until they begin to turn greyish-white. Return the to the Mortar, and grind them down. Repeat this process until you end up with a light-gray to white colored Salt. This is the Salt’s consecration by fire. You will find that Calcination greatly decreases the amount of Salt you have. It is efficacious to use a second plant of the exact same type, and calcinate it as well, to give you a greater store of the Salt to work with.

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The above quote is taken from the quick overview of spagyric making link in my first post. The salt is your dead yucky plant matter that has soaked in the everclear to extract its medicinal qualities. You put it in a fire safe container and burn it down, a clean stainless steel cooking pot would work. You work this in a mortar and pestle till you end up with the salt. You can see here the term salt was used to indicate both the plant matter as well as the ground up ash. They do this because they only care about the salt and since the cannabis has already given up its mercury (alchohol removed via fermenting which is skipped by using everclear) and sulphur (essential oils), that is all the plant has left to give.

Essentially RSO is 2/3 of the potential the medicine it can be. Hell it may only be 1/3 and making a true spagyric from the plant, fermenting it and all could very well be > than rso or rsoplus. My feelings are that its all in the rso method so rsoplus is simply a concentrated spagyric and the most potent medicine possible. This method could be used for any herb!

8. Now, we will purify the Salts with Water, using a technique called Leeching. This is the Solutio step in the Spagyric process. Take a small amount of Distilled water (you can distill tap water or spring water yourself, using your Retort, to remove most of the impurities. Pure rain water, caught before it touches the ground so that it is both Virginal and Pregnant with the Solar Sulfur works best) and dissolve the Salts into it. Stir for a couple of minutes, and then, taking up the funnel and coffee filter again, pour the combination into a shallow dish. What ever Salt is left in the funnel is insoluble in water, and is referred to in Spagery as the Caput Mortuum, the Death’s Head. Discard this truly dead matter. Place this dish where it will get some sun-and be otherwise undisturbed-and let it evaporate. Subtle heat may be applied to speed the process. As the water evaporates, the purified Salt body will appear. This is the Coagulation phase, when the water gives up it’s life for the Salt. This salt will be white, and should be ground once more in the mortar so that it is fine, if it is not fine already.

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A retort would be the additional equipment you would need to buy or cobble together. This is your distillation equipment. I would suggest spring water from the source at this point, god only knows what is in the rain. The rest is a very simplified version, you will recall I discussed the washing and separating of the salt was to be done seven times. Most likely what is printed here would work.

You then recombine this salt to your tincture to create the spagyric. This spagyric is then used to make the rso, which I would consider to be rsoplus.

This method would work great with the 1lb -> four syringes you ended up with. It is suggested to make a potent spagyric, you use the "salt" from a second batch. That means you split your tincture of cannabis into two equal containers. One container would reduce down to regular rso and fill two syringes while the other container that had the salt added to it would also be reduced down to rsoplus and also fill two syringes.

Two rso syringes, two rsoplus syringes. You could ask your patients to alternate from one to the other and record their results. Maybe in that information there will be enough evidence to determine if the end justify the means.

Think about it, especially if you are a provider.

An insightful post from another forum where I am trying to have this same discussion. On this forum, posters can be anonymous and the focus is not cannabis.

Yes. Let the distilled water evaporate off to get the salt. You can make it more pure by crushing the salt, re-dissolving it in distilled water, filtering and evaporating again.

About the alcohol. According to traditional alchemy, everything is made up of the three principles..

Salt = Body = Potassium Carbonate
Mercury = Spirit = Ethanol
Sulfur = Soul = Essential Oil

Spagyrics always have all three.

While the salt and sulfur are unique to each plant, the mercury (ethanol) is not. Mercury, as spirit, is universal among all plants. You want it to be very pure though (95%). If you can, get a distillation apparatus to pull off the pure ethanol.

There are many different levels of plant alchemy. What we are discussing is the most basic... spagyrics.

There is another alchemical method which is more powerful called an "ens". This method usually ends with the alcohol being evaporated off, but spagyrics always contain alcohol by definition.

Still... Alchemy is an art and there are no hard and fast rules. I believe that making a spagyric from cannabis and evaporating off the alcohol to get the oil would result in a more potent medicine than the usual method.

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So this poster is saying what I am proposing is called an "ens", which is a spagyric with the alcohol evaporated off. He/she claims it will be more potent than the regular method (rso method which is the basis for this work).

All reward, no risk. Potential, potential, potential.

http://hermetic.com/stavish/alchemy/plant2.html

The Ens

According to Paracelsus (really important guy in alchemy), the Ens is among the most powerful medicines, and yet one of the easiest to make. The ens, or entia (plural), is an influence, or principle that effects us, and is a definite spiritual, psychic, or physical thing. While five such principles are designated as creating illness within us, the ens tincture, created from the Vegetable Kingdom, can be used to correct these imbalances and bring us physical and psychic health.

One author writes, "The Ens manifests the highest initiatic virtue of the plant it is made from."

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The link provided describes "ens" in a different sense however, the "ens" appears to still have the alcohol present. I almost want to assume in the hermetic link, the potassium carbonate is the "salt" and this ens tincture is fortified with. This seems to be saying an "ens" is the spagyric with substantially more plant ash used. Which could be possible, always make and save your salt. Then you decide to make the "ens" tincture with all the additional salt. A fortified spagyric.

Here is your controlled double blind study. From yet another thread where I have been discussing cannabis on a non cannabis forum, these are my words. I am not asking anyone to take my word or even my findings as the truth. Find out for yourself, or not. I am sharing this idea here because I think there will be those of you who will understand the implications, I can not do a study on my own.

Two syringes of each, have whoever is taking the oil alternate syringes finishing each one and report their findings. Mark one syringe a, the other b and randomize the test.

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Parents are doing great, thanks for asking Soloman ! Following the CBD discipline, and I the Hemp Seed oil one.

If you ever manage to making that "rsoplus" without getting your *** in jail, maybe you'll want the share the cooking process here so that guys like me can try it in the household kitchen.

I may be an European jerk, but I'm a free european jerk regarding Hemp.

Best,

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eRLVyGfGcZs

Really great video about raw cannabis health that was linked in one of my other threads about this subject. Around 30-31 min in Dr. Courtney is showing a diagram that represents different cannabinoid functions. I was saying in the separation of cannabinoid thread, thc and cbd would work synergistically together as thca has a antiproliferative effect. It doesnt seem to me that there are any unwated cannabinoids at this point.

So for cancer you could use a plant that is high in cbd and thc, which is what I have been looking for. Or you could combine two different plants with two different profiles such as one being high in cbd and one high in thc to cover a broader range of cannabinoids. Since skipping decarbox makes the plant non psychoactive, making rso and rsoplus is still very important to overall health as you could much easier ingest non psychoactive oil than you could non psychoactive plant matter.

Eating raw and taking rso or rsoplus oil that is not decarboxed would be an excellent way to load up on all the good stuff and quite frankly a way of life moving forward.

I am coming to the following conclusion, using the rso method we can determine our own oil profile in three ways. Genetics, method of concentration and proper useage of decarboxylation of cannabiniods from one chemical to another.

This is already being done by a bluebird botanical who has has a complete cbd oil that uses both decarbox and non-decarbox to reach their desired profile of 1:1 ratios of both cbd to cbda and thc to thca.

The difference in what they offer and what I want to do is the concentration method. I want to add additional alchemical steps to extract out, purify and exalt the remaining medicinal properties of the plant.

I am thinking if done in this way, anyone can make rsoplus which would be much more complete than a standard rso.

Anyone know the temp range in decabrox where your thc has turned to cbn and you cbd is still active?

THC doesn't turn in to CBN. CBN is it's own cannabinoid.

AluminumMonster said:

THC doesn't turn in to CBN. CBN is it's own cannabinoid.

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Then I have come across incorrect information. The questions I have then are, is there a way to activate cbd through decarbox w/o activating the thc? Does thca break down to the same metabolites as thc and therefore trigger a hot test?

http://learnaboutmarijuanawa.org/factsheets/cannabinoids.htm

When THC is exposed to air it oxidizes and forms CBN.

Hackerman said:

http://learnaboutmarijuanawa.org/factsheets/cannabinoids.htm

When THC is exposed to air it oxidizes and forms CBN.

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I stand corrected. I apologize.

Hackerman said:

http://learnaboutmarijuanawa.org/factsheets/cannabinoids.htm

When THC is exposed to air it oxidizes and forms CBN.

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That matches some of the info found, drying it will eventually get to cbn, I believe it also will convert thca to thc. It is all part of the process and dependent upon time and temperature. Increasing the temperature while the bud is drying should speed up the process.

The whole focus of decarboxylation while making oils has been to create and preserve thc. I am looking to do the reverse, so that people who want the medicine can pass a drug screen.

It seems like there might be a sweet spot for doing such, I have a claim on another forum that it is doable. It just has not been explained to me yet nor do I know if it will.

Do you think it is possible who Rick Simpson is and his desire to help people played a factor in his treatment success rate?