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Old 04-17-2014, 03:40 PM   #1
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Default Organic Nutes

I am starting my annual summer organic dirt grow. In the past, it seems that my super soil is just not enough. For various reasons it is not always possible for me to brew up a batch of tea. So, I want to have some commercial organic nutes on hand. I have been looking at Earth Juice, Roots Organic, and iguana Juice. Any input on these or any other suggestions? I am still such a novice with organics.
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Old 04-17-2014, 03:48 PM   #2
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i like the earth juice line, hybrix, and and heavy 16 to back up ur organic mix thg---also if you leave some room in the pots to ammend with organics such as guanos, alfalfa, and others to top dress the soil as needed---u be fine---why u not just starting out with a hotter mix to begin with
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Old 04-17-2014, 03:57 PM   #3
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also check out the kelp 4 less website---they have lots of goodies your soil will love and your plants will thank you for
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Old 04-17-2014, 04:35 PM   #4
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THG, i was wrong, it is biotone, I ordered rose food and got mixed up. They call this starter food..Oh my gosh it smells like a cow pie and is way stronger then i would use on babies but 1/2 -1 cup at the bottom of the one gallon pots fed my kids beautifully.

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Old 04-17-2014, 04:47 PM   #5
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i have a love/hate relationship with iguana juice.
pulled some nice plants on it.. but disasters for unknown reasons too.
i can't recommend it for that reason along with it's pricetag.. though i keep buying it.

if it's just inbetween teas.. maybe AN's mother earth tea would be an ok choice (i used this initially before switching to iguana) very mild tea though. i actually use the MET veg and iguana juice bloom. just found the MET bloom was lacking for stand alone application.
thing i hate with AN though; they're always changing the npk ratio/recipe.

*i'm not a good source for organic info though.. i'm realizing i'm more the scientific 'paint by numbers' type of grower.. and don't have much of a greenthumb ..so you may experience better results


didn't you get the general organics trial pack they were giving out a while (years?) back? what'd you think of them? (i never tried the whole line, just veg, bloom and calmag.. got nice looking plants.. but pathetic yields)
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Old 04-17-2014, 06:16 PM   #6
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Orange, I just followed NC's recipe for super soil. I worry about starting with soil that is too hot, especially since I am such a novice at this. I will check out kelp-for-less site.

Thanks Rosebud, you are my organic guru. Since you have had such good luck using the Bio-tone for vegging, and since it will either be at my local hardware store (they carry quite a few Espoma products) or Amazon prime, I will give that a try first.

Kaotik, my organic cannabis grows have been less than stellar (to say the least). My vegetables however do absolutely wonderful. I know that I am doing something wrong, but not sure what. I think part of it is definitely the nutrients. I did notice that the Iguana Juice was more expensive than the other 2, so wondered if it was better. Great memory, kaotik, I did order the GO and I think it was years ago. I didn't like the GO for hydro, so gave it to a friend that was growing in soil. He liked it, but for the 6 or so parts. I just want something simpler. I don't want to be mixing up 6 or 8 different ingredients every batch of nutes.

Thanks for the input.

I have some Nurse Larry and some Larry OG just barely spouted.
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Old 04-17-2014, 11:11 PM   #7
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i use the bio tone as well. i agree it is very hot considering they advertise it for seedlings. it has a 4-3-3 NPK. just like rose i put a layer at the bottom. i also top dress with it as well though. to go along with the bio tone, i've become a big big fan of light warrior for seedlings and clones.
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Old 04-17-2014, 11:16 PM   #8
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THG - I can agree with a few people above, Epsoma makes some quality fertilizers that are cheap and available and most stores. Like Rose said, the starter food is great, I started using it last year as a dry top feeder and threw it in some tea's I made, also been using more of their lineup for a few years now (Tomato-tone, Plant-tone, Garden-tone)... Plan on throwing the starter food on the bottom of my pots like she suggested.

I have also used Fox Farms Happy Frog dry ferts (Tomato and Vegetable, All Purpose, Fruit & Flower, Bulb Food) with good results, again as a top feeder and in some tea's. Should be able to get them for ~$10/bag.

http://foxfarmfertilizer.com/index.p...rtilizers.html
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Old 05-17-2014, 04:02 AM   #9
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THG

I like to use a really hot mix with my plants. I put it down about 8-10" below roots. Although I am good about feeding the soil with teas. I think it helps with the microbes spreading it out nutes for the plant to absorbe evenly without burn. My teas have minimal nutes from E.J. Grow bat guano and other powders. May not be what your looking for though since teas aren't always possible. For a quick an easy recipe I would use E.J. line with Catalyst in it for sure. Just soak for a night prior to feed even with out aerating or heating. Just blow some bubbles in it. jmansweed has a great recipe for the E.J. line in a nute study-sticky in general indoor growing.

Don't forget your feeding the soil. If you do that you will be fine in organics
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Old 05-17-2014, 10:36 AM   #10
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AEM...Activated Effective MicroOrganisms
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Old 05-17-2014, 03:11 PM   #11
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I will check out the Earth Juice line and the AEM (which I know nothing about). Thanks guys!
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Old 05-17-2014, 09:10 PM   #12
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Hemp only advise i can give you is mix slow and fast releasing nutrients in your mix like Fish meal as a fast releasing N and something like feather meal which is opposite slow releasing N which will carry your grow thru long term
for the P nutrient something with fast releasing like Bone meal which is readily available to the plant then also adding Rock phosphate for the long term needs of P for the plant
For the K Kelp meal which again is readily available for the plant,
and look for Langbeinite which is a good source of potassium,sulfur, and magnesium and for calcium Dolomite lime
I also would look at adding silica to your soil
and then i would think of some type of tea to make and give plants every second week as a booster shot
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Old 10-23-2014, 06:07 AM   #13
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Smile soil takes breaking down, coco makes my day easy

im experiencing that organics has a secret.
it is to let for example the ffof to sit very lightly moist for over a month to let it break down a little.
and collect a little bacteria.
then dilute it down with happy frog or coco and/or perlite.
since I have no patience for letting soil to break down as it may take too long,
im going back to clean easy gh 3 pt in coco/chunky perlite. drain to waste. lucas 6 9, not 8-16 and of course a little cal-mag+. im excited. been readin...also like coconut oil cannaoil--unrefined. olive, canola, veg are all awful tasting in a spoon. coconut is yum and maybe healthier. gh 3pt in coco/perlite drain to waste may be my new favorite way.
I read the 6 9 is coco and 8 16 for lucas hydro. i'll be coco so either is drier than soil..more oxygen. and it feels sooo nice. no mud
6 9 means 6 mil micro/gal and 9 mil bloom/gal
rinse once weekly. feed once weekly...just what I read. watching will be key. tired of teas too. no green thumb here.
gh3pt.
also the coco bricks are sterile. the bugs comes from excess tea stuff and overwatering. and spider mites and excess heat go together
ps. I read all of hemp goddess posts, I wanna learn. the hushpuppy not bad either. and pcduck is nice. go ducks. growing is fun hobby

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Old 10-23-2014, 01:07 PM   #14
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Hey THG I like kelp 4 less and blue mountain organics and EM1 of course.
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Old 10-23-2014, 04:09 PM   #15
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Thanks everyone. I think that I am probably going to end up going organic this winter also. I usually go with hydro in the winter, but my circumstances are going to be a lot different this winter.

I bought a chunk of coco and am deciding how I am going to use it. I have about 5 cubic feet of good super soil that has been cooking for a while and can be used anytime. I picked up the GO Box to supplement my organic soil and for those times when I do not have time to make tea and have been quite happy with it, so I will probably continue to use that. I also really like the Espoma products and will be using more of them as they will be readily available.

I do not get the volume out of my organic plants that I get from the hydro, but the plants are going to have to be in other people's care part of the time so9, I want it as easy as possible.
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Old 12-19-2014, 01:43 AM   #16
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When I make a mix it's not quite as hot as NC's, but close. I use the single amendments and minerals and whatnot. It's not enough, but to make it enough it would be entirely too hot to be practical. I also use single amendments on the re-amends, mainly the NPK stuff and very little of the minerals (rock dust, Azomite and the like). Lime and gypsum are the exceptions, but still not added at full strength, perhaps 1/2 to 3/4 of the original amount. Calcium is almost as important as N and my observations have borne this out.

Fresh or homemade Vermicompost is also a BIG++++++ and doing worms is stupid easy. All you need is room for a 18gal rubbermaid tote (~1 1/2'x2 1/2'), food scraps or manure and some bedding. This could be newspapers, cardboard, or even the SS mix. They are also the original LITFA animals. I seldom check on my bins more often than every 2 weeks. Think about this for when warm weather returns. Reputable worm sellers won't ship in freezing temps.

BUT!!!! What I was taking so long to get around to is during the grow and the mix running out of steam. *I* use Espoma as a top dress. I have several flavors of 'tones' for different plants, but all are so similar ........

The big trick and learning experience, is top dressing 2 weeks or so before the plant actually needs it. It takes that long at least to become available and if you wait till the plant shows a need you are 2 weeks to a month behind the curve. I found this out the hard way the first season I did it and am still learning. The first top dress using a fresh mix is the real hard part, after that I would do another top dress 3-4 weeks later and so on during the growing season.

Mixing the 'tone' with a bit of vermicompost is like squirting ether in a carb. Big results! I mix about 5 party cups of tone and 2-3 of VC in a coffee jug and use that mix for top dressing. My peppers and tomatoes kept producing till the first killing frost.

Like I said, the hard part is when to do the first top dressing with the tone. Depending on plant growth and container size *I* usually figure no sooner than a month and no later than 6 weeks when starting with fresh SS. This also depends on how hot the SS is to begin with. So many judgement calls in organics, but worth it in the end.

The yield WILL come up! If you managed to raise a kid(s), organics is a snap .... sorta.

Wet
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Old 12-19-2014, 05:02 PM   #17
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Wetdog, I do do worms. I have the coolest little worm bin that is so odor free that it can be put into the house. I am on a septic tank and do not have a disposer, don't believe in giving food scraps to dogs, so having a worm bin and a compost bin is ideal for me. I can't believe it took me so long to do it though.

I use Bio-Tone and Plant-Tone a lot, but not any of the other Tone products. I will try mixing the worm casting with either the Bio or the Plant Tone. I find I like the Bio-Tone when they are smaller.

Thanks for the suggestions. I will continue to plug away (and learn) this organic stuff.
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Old 12-19-2014, 08:47 PM   #18
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Yeah, come top dress time take whatever amount of 'tone' you will need and add about 1/3-1/2 of that amount of VC and mix. I usually use an empty coffee jug since we have plenty and you can pop a lid on if you don't use all the mix. I know the tones have microbes in them, but the 'crobes in the VC seem to kick everything into a higher gear.

BTW, worms love used grounds if you are a coffee drinker. They love tea, bags and all if you go that route.

BTW, finished compost is one of the best worm bedding/foods there is. The worms take something good and turn it into something great! Try some as the layers between the food scraps and see for yourself.

How long have you had your bin and what kind is it? I've noticed that after about a year it really starts humming. IMO, it's the microbes adapting to your particular environment. I do add some the VC from a harvested bin to the new bin+fresh bedding and it really helps the process along. I mean, the first harvest was good, but subsequent harvests were so much beyond.

Wet
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Old 12-20-2014, 03:15 PM   #19
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THG, for nutes, I use Earth Juice line.

Wetdog, those were great posts. I put a "new composter" on my christmas list... I love organics and the rich dark soil that smells of goodness.

I always sprinkle some microbes.. But I am thinking about getting this..
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Old 12-20-2014, 03:25 PM   #20
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Wetdog, I cannot remember who manufacturers the kind I have, but it is small (about 2' in diameter) and round and has 4 different layers. I drink both coffee and tea and they do get a good amount of both coffee grounds and tea bags. There are always more produce scraps in the summer, but they do still get their fair share of that. I used coco for bedding when I sat it up and now I just add food and they make stuff. I'll remember using compost.


Rosebud, I've actually been quite happy with the GO products, for a premade organic fertilizer. If anything--I just ordered a new box and received them yesterday. I'll check out the Earth Juice next go around.
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