1. Bud of the Month: Squish / No name plant
    Dismiss Notice

Battling a Potential Nutrient Deficiency

Discussion in 'Beginners Growing Forum' started by VTGrower, Aug 5, 2018.

  1. Aug 5, 2018 #1

    VTGrower

    VTGrower

    VTGrower

    Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2018
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    3
    Gender:
    Male
    Hi all,

    I've noticed some strange changes in my plants recently and am trying to find the cause. I am 2 months into my first grow and just recently joined this forum. I have 2 plants growing in the vegetative state, 2 moths old, germinated about 1 week apart from one another. One is an auto flowering Tangerine Dream and one is from a seed found in an unidentified bud (most likely not auto flowering). The plants started in rockwool cubes and were transplanted into 5 gallon fabric pots in Fox Farms Ocean Forest soil with some extra perlite mixed in. The plants are sitting under a 600W LED light 24 hours a day and I have not been feeding them any nutrients besides what the soil can provide. The temperature is around 65-75 degrees in the grow tent most days with a humidity around 65-75%.

    I noticed a few days ago that some of the branches have become a red/purple color on the top half of the branch only. Leading up to this I had noticed some fan leaves developing small brown spots as well, generally on the lower leaves but not exclusively. I originally thought the brown spots could be a calcium deficiency, but the red branches coupled with the brown spots make me think it could be a phosphorous deficiency instead. As this is my fist attempt growing I wanted to hear from others who are more knowledgeable in the area before I start trying to fix something I have falsely diagnosed. What strikes me as strange is how perfect the line is between the green area of the branch and the red area of the branch. The transition from red to green is a nearly perfect, straight line that begins almost exactly halfway through the branch every time.

    A second question I have is in regard to the drooping fan leaves I have been experiencing on the plant that came from the unidentified bud. I realize that over or under watering can lead to this, as can other deficiencies in the plant. And in my case it may have something to do with the red branches mentioned above. But is it possible for leaves to droop down under their own weight while perfectly healthy? I ask because the plant in question has very large fan leaves, and I don't know if I should ever expect them to stick straight out due to the size and weight of the leaf, or some plants naturally have droopy leaves due to their size.

    Thanks for taking the time to read this and for any help offered, if I left any details out or if anyone would like to see more pictures I'm happy to oblige. Bonus points if anyone can identify the unknown plant I have if that's possible. All pictures are of the unknown plant.
     

    Attached Files:

  2. Aug 5, 2018 #2

    umbra

    umbra

    umbra

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2007
    Messages:
    7,925
    Likes Received:
    2,319
    Gender:
    Male
    what is the ph of the water? if ph is off, nute lockout
     
  3. Aug 5, 2018 #3

    VTGrower

    VTGrower

    VTGrower

    Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2018
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    3
    Gender:
    Male
    Ahh I was afraid I'd miss a detail. I took the ph of water that drained out the bottom yesterday. Using the test droplets in a cheap ph kit I thought it was around 6-6.5?I attached a picture if you want to judge for yourself.
     

    Attached Files:

  4. Aug 5, 2018 #4

    burnin1

    burnin1

    burnin1

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2009
    Messages:
    2,011
    Likes Received:
    365
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Mariposa County CA
    A couple things that this may or may not be from quick observation.

    A good fertilizer should provide all of the nutes you need. Sometimes your water can have an excess nutes and can cause some slight problems.
    Red or purple stems can be caused by stress. heat, cold, high humidity, ect.
    Overwatering or underwatering can cause the leaves to droop and even turn yellow or look like other nutrient problems.
    It is not normal for your leaves to droop like that. Back in the day when I used plastic pots I needed a moisture meeting to prevent overwatering.

    The spots on the leaves almost look like they could Yellow leaf spot . Although like I said over or underwatering can eventually causes the leaves to look funky as well . Yellow leaf spot happens most often in warm wet environments as it is a fungus of sorts.

    It seems like you are on the right track to fixing this problem. There are many growers here with tons more experience and knowledge than me. You came to the best place to get help.

    I hope you get this resolved soon.

    Good luck with your awesome grow!
     
  5. Aug 6, 2018 #5

    VTGrower

    VTGrower

    VTGrower

    Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2018
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    3
    Gender:
    Male
    Thanks everyone for the replies so far. As of now I'm wondering if it is humidity. The grow tent has been set up in the basement, and it could be too humid down there for the plants. I am going to move the tent upstairs where it is hopefully less humid and see if that changes anything. I'm not sure if the red color will ever disappear from the old branches but I'll be monitoring new growth to see if any color change happens.
     
  6. Aug 6, 2018 #6

    orangesunshine

    orangesunshine

    orangesunshine

    Drama Free

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2010
    Messages:
    3,721
    Likes Received:
    198
    imho i see over watering, root bound, or overheating is your droopy leaf issue---root zone needs to dry out a bit in between waterings---bigger pots are ALWAYS BETTER when growing in soil---depending on your pot sizes in relation to the plant size, RH, and temps---my guess is you should only be watering once or 2wice a week---the extra perlite was a good call to encourage good drainage---the fox farm soil you are using is plug and play ready for vegging plants so you do not have a nutrient deficiency---high ph of your water is likely causing your lock out and soon those beautiful plants will be turning yellow from the bottom up---although organics are more forgiving than hydro---ph is still the key to them being the best they can---you might consider acidifying your water a bit to lower your ph with some apple cider vinegar, aluminum sulfate, crushed pine needles, saw dust, coffee grounds---tap water with a premium soil like fox farms likely has your ph above 7 and your only issue---iv'e grown more than my share of underachieving weed and can only hope to have learned thru trial and error---best of luck
     
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2018
    burnin1, pcduck and Rosebud like this.
  7. Aug 7, 2018 #7

    VTGrower

    VTGrower

    VTGrower

    Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2018
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    3
    Gender:
    Male
    I've have a little PH kit I started using to make sure the water I'm using isn't too acidic or basic. I think the issue may be partially humidity related, and possibly heat. I think it's less likely that it's root bound but that is still a very real possibility. I do know it has been especially hot and humid here lately. I moved the plants out of the grow tent and let them sit outside in the sun for a day. The leaves perked right up, although the tips are still curling downward a bit, I've attached a photo below and overall the plant looks much healthier than it did the other day. A day out in the open in the sun seemed to really help. The question now is if I should cut off the leaves that seem to be drying up and turning brown. There are 4 leaves currently that are affected to the point I would consider cutting them off. Of those 4 there are 2 particularly big fan leaves that got worse over the course of today which makes me nervous, but for all I know it could take a couple days for the symptoms to stop progressing. Regardless I still get nervous watching the condition of the affected leaves deteriorate. Here's hoping that if the humidity stays under control the next couple of days things will return back to normal. To make matters complicated I'll be leaving the state for 5 days starting Wednesday so that presents an extra challenge, as I won't be around for the potential recovery. I plan on watering the plants right before I leave, and worst case I have someone that can check on them for me but they will mostly be on their own for those 5 days. Thanks again everyone for all the help and ideas.
     

    Attached Files:

    burnin1 likes this.
  8. Aug 7, 2018 #8

    orangesunshine

    orangesunshine

    orangesunshine

    Drama Free

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2010
    Messages:
    3,721
    Likes Received:
    198
    high rh can also make it difficult for the plants to transpire and cause droopy fan leaves---over watering does not help that issue---i would remove the discolored leaves--a close up pic of them would be helpful as the spidermite will also cause a yellow leaf-nor would i be transporting the plants in and outdoor and pick a spot and stay put---that back and forth invites future insect issues in your tent---how is the fresh air circulation/exchange in the tent? your post inspired me to make my plants a pot of coffee this morning to lower my ph---in short---your plants have great color---your description leads me to believe the ph is too high, and the soil is too wet---if you don't have spidermites, and get control of the ph and watering---my guess is you will be back on track in no time---best
     
    burnin1 and pcduck like this.
  9. Aug 7, 2018 #9

    VTGrower

    VTGrower

    VTGrower

    Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2018
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    3
    Gender:
    Male
    I'll take some time and remove the affected leaves tonight, but I took some pictures of them as they are on the plant right now. I tried to get as close as I could before my camera lost focus. Thanks for the heads up on moving the plants back and forth from indoor to outdoor, there have been some really sunny days here that got me wondering if there were any downsides to letting them get some natural light temporarily. For ventilation I have a 4 inch carbon filter hooked up to a small inline vent fan using passive intake so the fan is outside the tent pulling air through, and I recently added an oscillating fan to the tent as well. It sounds like I should try to lower the ph of the water I'm giving them and watch the humidity. I'll try to snip the leaves off tonight very carefully.
     

    Attached Files:

    burnin1 likes this.
  10. Aug 7, 2018 #10

    umbra

    umbra

    umbra

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2007
    Messages:
    7,925
    Likes Received:
    2,319
    Gender:
    Male
    nute splash
     
  11. Aug 7, 2018 #11

    orangesunshine

    orangesunshine

    orangesunshine

    Drama Free

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2010
    Messages:
    3,721
    Likes Received:
    198
    With all due respect to Umbra's call of nute splash---i didn't think you were adding anything to your water---either way---have a peek at the undersides of those discolored leaves you are picking off to look for any black dots or pin size spidermites with a magnifying glass---oscillating fan and negative pressure in the tent is good
     
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2018
  12. Aug 8, 2018 #12

    burnin1

    burnin1

    burnin1

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2009
    Messages:
    2,011
    Likes Received:
    365
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Mariposa County CA
    I am wondering if your fabric pots sit in standing water for a period of time after watering. Leaves drooping down like that make me wonder.
     
  13. Aug 9, 2018 #13

    VTGrower

    VTGrower

    VTGrower

    Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2018
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    3
    Gender:
    Male
    You may be onto something with the standing water, the pots weren't sitting in any, but the trays just underneath my pots had accumulated some water after my previous watering. Even though the pots werent sitting directly in it, i think having excess standing water in the tent added too much humidity.
     
    burnin1 likes this.

Share This Page