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Did I loose yield cause of cloning?

maystor

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Hi all,
I've been growing 6 generations of 1 mother and seem to be loosing yield for my last 2 grows. Potency is fine but my buds are mostly leafy with a lot of trichs but very few calyxes. You can compare these 2 pics from the original plant from seed and generation six clone. I am also confused cause since my first grow I always aim to improve my growing technique. Both pics are taken at week 6 of flowering. Do you thin this strain might be "depleted"
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Rosebud

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I have done 6 generations of clones and have never had this experience.
That is very weird. Something else must be different?
 

pcduck

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When was the last time you changed your bulbs?
 

Growdude

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Maybe too much N in the bloom formula :confused2:
 
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Although I have heard that you can get degradation cloning from clones, but in real life, this has not been my experience. However that does not mean that it couldn't happen. Can you think of anything else that may have contributed to the difference?
 

maystor

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Hi,
I usually don't use nutes during veg cause I always use new soil (same brand). My flowering nutes are 4-7-7. My lights set up is 150 HPS + 2x30wCFL (6400K) and has always been the same bulbs.
This is a bagseed strain but turned out to be killer quiality .. or at least the first few grows. Its also a heavy indica strain cause its 50/50 amber/cloudy by 7,5-8 weeks flowering and always stays pretty short.
 
D

dman1234

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Ive been clonning the same plant for 4 years come this May, and its only gotten better.
 

7greeneyes

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I cloned from cloned for eight years (same donor plant, same strain...everything, copy of a copy of a copy...etc...) straight and INDEED they do lose hybrid vigor (course i had received this from the original grower after a cpl years in his custody as well...). They got spindly and completley changed growth characteristics down to the taste, potency and yield.
But after just SIX successive cloning generations, I just don't see any plant being that unstable. Most likely a bad light, light leaks, or mayhaps unhygenic growing practices.

One of the things I found in my research is that Shantibaba says to keep a mother plant outside for a whole "grow" cycle, take cuttings and then bring those inside, for your "indoor" grows. That'll keep a fav strain vital and usable through the years...too bad I learned that 3 years after losing that clone-only killer skunk cut :( ... :rolleyes:
 

Hushpuppy

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maystor said:
Hi,
I usually don't use nutes during veg cause I always use new soil (same brand). My flowering nutes are 4-7-7. My lights set up is 150 HPS + 2x30wCFL (6400K) and has always been the same bulbs.
This is a bagseed strain but turned out to be killer quiality .. or at least the first few grows. Its also a heavy indica strain cause its 50/50 amber/cloudy by 7,5-8 weeks flowering and always stays pretty short.
Do you mean that you have never changed these bulbs? They have lasted this long without failing? If that is correct, then you need new bulbs. :)
 

OGKushman

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It does appear to be light issues. TO ME, it almost looks like a light leak causing minor vegetative growth during flowering.

A plant that gets 12/12 of intense light, but also receives a small amount during its dark cycle will continue to grow vegetative leafs with lots of trics on them. That plant looks outdoor.

Definitely change those bulbs and see if next grow is better, and really check for leaks.
 

maystor

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Thanks guys,

About the bulbs (the HPS) - do they loose lumens with age? I didn't know that.
 
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Roddy

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Yes....or that's my assumption. They lose intensity...which I am assuming means lumens!
 

Hushpuppy

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Yes they absolutely will lose lumens with age. The gasses that are held inside the element will break down over time from the intense heat of being energized with high voltage electricity. This will cause them to produce less lumens and more heat. If I remember correctly, most bulbs are rated for 20,000 hours of run time before failure but that doesn't at all account for the thermal break down of the element. I would hazard a guess that the chemical break down and significant loss of lumens occurs after about 10-15k hours.

Sometimes you can get that one bulb where all the best materials out of the batch was used in this one bulb, and that makes it keep its efficacy far longer than average. But those are few and far between. Also hot starts, surges, dust, oils, and rough treatment will often significantly shorten the life of the bulb or weaken the lumen output without you ever realizing it unless and until you put it up next to a new bulb where you can really see the difference.

I had that happen not too long ago with one of my bulbs in the Grow-lab. It got wacked while working in the space(fricken brand new bulb) and noticed a week later that it wasn't shining as bright as the others around it. A week later it failed. That is why it is best to increase your initial lumen estimation when setting up a room with lighting by about 10-20%. That way when the light starts losing lumen output at the halfway point of its life, you don't end up with low light conditions messing up the plants during the bloom. :)
 

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