Gnats and nutes turning my green thumb black.

[matthew2]

Tried to introduce self in lobby but link wasn't working. So I am doing it here. Matthew, in my 60's, disabled and therefore must grow my own medication. Dispensaries prices are way out of my league.I am a medical patient. Attempting perpetual grow. First batch went soooo smooth. Little light on yield but nice nugs good quality. As my second set started flowering I got gnats. I tried to control, much research, hydrogen peroxide, neem oil sprays and drench, gnat nix, pasteurized new soil, etc...Controlled for a while but I am sure others have chased this dragons tail. Thank God it is outdoor grow season. I have taken all plants outside. I am in the process of cleaning and sanitizing grow room. I will be starting my perpetual again next month. From all the posts, articles, local nurseries that folks have been most pleased with the bits/dunks and neem cake top dressing and drenches. I plan on using both but want to make sure they are compatible. Anyone try this or have advice?

My next question is nutes. I follow the feeding schedules and have run into deficiencies mid to late flower on the last 3 batches. Was never at an infestation rate. Very confusing. Gnats under control and nutes given per feeding schedule. I am using root organics. I have both liquid and solid (not at the same time, on different plants to judge/experiment results) I am NOT over feeding. I am sure of that. When plants start to show defeciency I try to diagnose what they are wanting more of. It is hard to tell/diagnose as many of same symptoms are different needs. By the time I can diagnose correctly it is to late to bump yield or really do anything to help them be happier. Question is. Is there something(s) I can feed in addition to the root organics that would cover all of the most common dececiences. I am using coco loco with some extra perlite, a bit of coffeee, Epsom salts, and bone meal. A friend, God bless him gave me his lights. 380/600 lifted LED's and 400 mh/hps. Temps and humidity control in recommended ranges. Good circulation with fans. Small oscillating and a 10" inline w/ carbon filter 24/7. Pretty sure I have most critical factors covered. I have had a pretty green thumb my entire life. can someone help set me straight please. I need my meds. And thank you!

Matthew

 

[hollowpoint]

Hi Matthew
Welcome to MP...Someone here can help you out for sure. Just by chance have you checked your PH on the water and correct it if needed?

 

[matthew2]

7.0 out of the tap. PH down to 6. Run off around 6.2-6.5. I let it set in wide mouthed container for 24 hours. Chlorine etc. Just purchased highly rated and reviewed Dupont water filter. Defective, PPM remain the same. So yes, I considered water also and have taken steps to remove from the equation. Am seriously considering making my own super soil so I don't have to mess with PH at all. Trying to save up the money...ugg.

 

[Keef]

Welcome to MP Matthew !
It's the Knats causing what looks Iike a deficiency- The ones flying do no damage to the plants but they lay eggs on the moist soil - The larvae will eat at your roots and ruin your crop-- Some top dress with DE - It's a sand with real sharp edge supposed to kill the larvae- I faced that Knat problem and ended up growing in water !-- I bought an aero cloner and never went back to dirt !
It's a serious problem U got there !

 

[Keef]

Matthew- For the medical part I think I can help too !--U get the most benefit for eating weed than smoking it !-- I make cannacaps or an oil tincture -- 1st U Bake your weed to decarb or what they call "Activate " it - Bake at about 275 F for maybe 45 minutes - Trim works just fine -- At that point if U want to grind up the weed and pack it into empty gel caps - U got my cannacaps - U have to find your own dosage !- I take a dose 3 times a day!- I was out of empty caps so I made a tincture I'm taking instead right now - 4 parts of ground up weed and 6-7 parts oil - coconut or olive work fine - Simmer for an hour or more after the decarb then filter off the oil and that's your medicine !-- The weed need the oil to be obsorbed into your body properly !-

 

[thegloman]

Welcome Mathew!
I also grow in soil indoors. I learned a VALUABLE lesson on gnat control. Use large growing containers and let the top 2" of soil stay dry. Top dress with lots of pearlite so water drains down. Top is dry, lower down, plenty moist. Gnats hate dry. Use the commercial stuff too if needed but try this first.
As far as sterilizing your soil, I would be sure to add beneficial bacteria back into it if you do.

 

[2RedEyes]

Hey Matthew, welcome to MP...sounds like gloman has a good idea there...I’m trying the super soil route myself here in a few weeks...I mixed up a batch a few weeks ago and it’s been cookin in the back yard...I’m hoping to feed just water and some organic teas thru out the grow...this will be an outdoor grow of autoflower plants...inside I’ve been growing in coco chips but I’m thinking I may try indoor organics if this outdoor thing goes smoothly...what are the chances of that...lol
There are smarter folks round here than me so they’ll get you straight...good luck with your grow!

 

[The Hemp Goddess]

Why are you not growing outdoors this summer? There are a lot of advantages to growing outdoors. One of them is that you can probably get a large enough crop so that you do not have to battle the problems of growing indoors.

Also as the Roots Organic doesn't seem to be working for you, I would advise trying another line of nutrients. You shouldn't have to be tweaking their feeding schedule like you have had to.

 

[Aksarben]

@matthew2 Welcome !! Lots of very knowledgable folks here to give you pointers, that's for sure.
@Keef You said

The weed need the oil to be obsorbed into your body properly !-

I make up 30-31 mg of decarbed Phantom OG for my wife. She does not want any more than this as more makes her a bit unsteady. Uses it right before bed to help with sleep. I have read about mixing in oil, like Extra Virgin Olive oil into it, and after putting in 31 mg of weed into capsule I add a tiny drop of olive oil directly into the capsule. What you are saying is oil is rather important for better utilization?

Matthew, I'm growing some Autoflowers outdoors, after I started indoors, and transferred to fabric pots. I just used Miracle Grow potting mix and they are doing great guns, but these new ones outside, and the couple I started a lot earlier... Jan '19. I use(d) Foliage Pro fertilizer. Used it before with my dwarf orange trees but also used it on my new weed plants. Saw a couple advertisements in GROW magazine with kudos from Marijuana growers that used it. I found on Amazon, but you might find it locally and/or at a better price.

 

[matthew2]

I appreciate the input.

Let me clear up a couple things. Not the world's best wordsmith.

I pasteurize my soil not sterilize. 170 degrees kills eggs, seeds, larvae, etc. That temperature does not kill beneficial microbes. Or any thing beneficial for that matter. Many people confuse pasteurize with sterilize. Very common error.

I do/did let soil dry out. I bottom watered. I top dressed with 4 inches of gnat nix. I used medical micropore tape over the holes in bottom. Gnats (or any crawlies) can't) get through that barrier. This cuts off access to the bottom. I left the top soil dry the entire grow. That is a myth that gnats don't survive dry soil. They do. I have top dressed. I have sprayed. I have used DE, gnat nix, perlite, sand, azamat. etc. etc. etc. I never had an infestation. Just a few stragglers. Impossible to get them all. I am not concerned about the past. I am concerned about moving forward. All plants are removed from the home. Zero plants of any kind in my home. I do not have any gnats living in my drains or drip pan of fridge. I have eliminated all gnats that were in my home. It is a no gnat zone. I want to keep it that way moving forward. I am getting ready to prep room to start next grow. Just waiting on clones.

My primary question remains:

Can I use neem cake and mosquito bits together as a double deterrent/preventative with my new grow?
No one has answered that. Does anyone have input or experience using both simultaneously. Or even individually. I will be doing this as a preventative. Hopefully. There will be no gnats or critters of any kind when I start. I want to keep it that way.

I grow inside because I live in a condo Assoc. with a patio that is so small I must go inside to change my mind. (joking, sorta, it is tiny)
Indoors is only way I can prevent rippers from climbing my fence. and assuring I get to harvest. I will have to risk it with plants I moved outdoors. Fingers crossed.

Regarding baking, frying, boiling. That destroys the THC. Why in the world would I (or most anyone else) want to do that? I smoke for sleep, pain, and anxiety relief. I have multiple mental disorders and reject the pain killers, sleep aids, antidepressants, etc. medical doctors prescribed. They make things worse. Smoking or vaping brings me much relief. I prefer natural over big pharma.

Thanks to all that are trying to help the old geezer out. Appreciate you!

Matthew

 

[Aksarben]

Regarding baking, frying, boiling. That destroys the THC. Why in the world would I (or most anyone else) want to do that?

Can you expand on that thought a bit? Only though heat can THCa be turned into THC... well some does change, but very slowly and more degradation into CBN than THC though. If smoked, that heat is the final catalyst to remove the acid group and leave behind just the THC.

Mosquito bits... You referring to Mosquito dunks, that have BT as a mode of action? BT is an all around excellent biological insecticide against any larva, and should work, even without the Neem. Personally, I'd pass on the Neem.

 

[Missfit]

Hi Matt, I agree with AK. on the dunks, just bust em up and use with perlite and soil for a top dressing.I had a critter problem once and used a couple of aerosol bug bombs in the grow room between rounds.I also tossed the Fox Farm and found a new go to high quality soil, no more bugs. It sounds like you misunderstand the purpose and process of decarboxylation It is explained well if you google it. Myself I use freshly cured bud on a cookie sheet, 40 min. at 240 . Sassy

 

[The Hemp Goddess]

I'm thinking that it would be better if you could figure out why you are getting fungus gnats in the first place and try to correct that, rather than having to treat for them with questionable products.

 

[matthew2]

As previously stated. I am not a wordsmith. I meant degrade not destroy. I also should have said high temps. I degrade some smoke for daytime use. You just flat out do not get stoned on weed cooked at high temps.

"Generally speaking, lower cooking temperatures are better. THC is completely degraded at temperatures in excess of 392 degrees F although it starts to break down long before that. Since water boiling never gets above 212 degrees F, I always recommend adding water for recipes if wanting to retain maximum potency."

The key is THC starts to break down long before 392 is reached.

Mosquito bits are pellets of mosquito dunks. Same thing.

I really appreciate all the input, advice, and different points of view.

Here are my thoughts on why I want to use neem cake with the bits/dunks. The dunks will kill the larvae. Most not all is what I hear to expect. The neem is a natural repellant. If a few make it to adults they wouldn't return to plants that have neem on soil surface and absorbed by the plant itself. If they avoid then no eggs and cycle is interrupted.

Find a plant with gnats. Sprinkle neem cake on the soil surface. Watch them flee lickity split.

Am merely curious if:
A. someone has tried this neem/dunks combo
B. If there are any contraindications, conflicts, or dangers in doing so.

I hope never see a gnat inside again. That these precautions end up being exactly that. One can dream.

Matthew

 

[2RedEyes]

...

 

[thegloman]

No, never in combo.
Keep us posted on your research tho bro. We can ALL use a method that works one time or another.

 

[Aksarben]

@matthew2 I'd think real long and hard at using Neem oil on soil such as used around Marijuana since that plant is well known for up-taking a lot of toxic things if it is in contact with. Check this link: http://skunkisland.ca/medical-cannabis/649/cannabis-hyperemesis-syndrome-neem-poisoning/ Colorado thought they had a huge bunch of cases of this CHS from marijuana usage, but may have bee from smoking weed that had been treated with Neem. This article gives a pretty clear picture. https://steemit.com/cannabis/@drutt...e-chs-is-actually-azadirachtin-neem-poisoning This last link explains how "good" cannabis is at uptake of heavy metals and other.

 

[The Hemp Goddess]

I'm not a fan of neem either. I'd forgotten that they believe that CHS could be caused by neem. Thanks for reminding us the importance of being vigilant about what we put on our plants.

 

[Missfit]

I'm thinking that it would be better if you could figure out why you are getting fungus gnats in the first place and try to correct that, rather than having to treat for them with questionable products.

Fox Farm is widely known for supplying free critters in its growing mediums. Toss the F.F. and find a better soil. Imho. Sassy