hermie seeds?

resin ball

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should seeds from a hermie plant be used for future grows or am i just asking for trouble?
 

naturalhi

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I use them, when you buy them they're called feminized seeds. They produce female plants since they are self germinated, on the down side keep a close eye on them they are capable of going hermie again easily!
 

Mutt

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I have to disagree. Fem'd seeds are not hermied by light leaks and other variables.
They do change the light schedule or use gibberilic acid to "reverse" the sex. then they are stabilized. I can get you a lot of info, but there is more to it than just it being a hermi.
Hermi's from a bagseed or from a hermied plant that an average joe grew. Will carry the hermie trait along with it. So your chances of a female or a male are less and the chances of a hermie are the highest.
The only thing I do with hermie seeds is crush them and throw em out.
IMO.

Don't get me going on Fem'd seeds. I think they are a waste of money. If given the proper environment (temp and humidity) and proper light spectrum (mixed florous or MH during veg.) I always get a higher female ratio from regular seeds.
 

Hick

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Mutt said:
I have to disagree. Fem'd seeds are not hermied by light leaks and other variables.
They do change the light schedule or use gibberilic acid to "reverse" the sex. then they are stabilized. I can get you a lot of info, but there is more to it than just it being a hermi.
Hermi's from a bagseed or from a hermied plant that an average joe grew. Will carry the hermie trait along with it. So your chances of a female or a male are less and the chances of a hermie are the highest.
The only thing I do with hermie seeds is crush them and throw em out.
IMO.

Don't get me going on Fem'd seeds. I think they are a waste of money. If given the proper environment (temp and humidity) and proper light spectrum (mixed florous or MH during veg.) I always get a higher female ratio from regular seeds.
100% agreement here. Hermies are, as an old friend of mine used to refer to them, "Poison Pills". They are not 'feminized' seeds. They are geneticly flawed and will pass along the faulty genetics to future generations.
As it was explained to me by an old hand with many years of breeding experience behind his conclusions/theories...
"Breeding with hermies is detrimental to the gene pool of drug quality cannabis. If left to procreate on its own, mj will within a few generations, revert to low quality weeds/hemp. Why?..because in the wild, with no human intervention to "select" parentage, hermies and/or early flowering males dominate the Paternal genetics of the gene pool."
Paternal genetics are at least as important to the breeding of quality cannabis as the maternal portion. Would you intentionally breed your $2,000 Grand Champion Show winning Labrador to the mongrel stray from down the alley?...Probably not. :rolleyes:
 

naturalhi

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Damn! meet, " Hermi's from a bagseed or from a hermied plant that an average joe grew" an Orang I know has 30 females out of 35 sprouts, 20 of which are from last grow, hermied, they're 2weeks into flower and doing wonderfully, so far,

Dissing me is for kids, thinking one knows everthing there is to know about any subject is just ingnorance, sorry if you feel that I'm reacting too strongly, but the old timers on this site seem to feel they have all the answer and newbies must learn from them not with them, right Stoney Bud?, oh well I shouldn't even post this 'cause I know you'll come back with some scathing posts! Just had to remind ya'll:

Speak your truth quietly and clearly; and listen to others, even the dull and the ignorant; they too have their story.
 
S

Stoney Bud

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naturalhi said:
right Stoney Bud?
No. It's not right. Check your private messages. I've replied in full there. We don't throw stones at each other on this group. Any problems you have with someone in this group must be discussed in private messages. Not in the open forum.
 

Hick

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hey nat...I don't think anyone was "dissing" you, only pointing out a difference of opinion, and a valid one. No need to lash out.
If you believe that "femminised" seeds are made by the respected breeders by pollination of hermie plants or pollination with hermie pollen, "I" believe you are sadly mistaken. And it reflects your knowledge of both genetics and of the femminization process. Not "dissing" you, dissing your,though be it unintentional, mis-information.
Don't take my word for it, research the information for yourself. It's not hard to find and you seem relatively competent in front of a pc. But, if you fail to find it, feel free to pm me and I'll dig up a link or two for you.
This "oldtimer" here isn't professing to "know everything", and if you have some valid information that refutes my claims, I'm happy to listen AND discuss it with you. As long as we can keep it civil. No name calling, no more "your ignorant" crap, but with an open mind and on a mature level.
 

Mutt

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naturalhi,
Hey man, It was not my intent to seem like I was dissing you. I just disagreed.
As you can tell, Fem'd seeds and Hermie seeds are a very debatable topic. I think this is what makes the forums so good. "Discussion" and "different points of view" are important. If everyone agreed about everything the forum would get boring fast. I don't mean aurguments and flaming sessions, but getting different points of view are great. Never once in my reply did I point a finger. All I said is "I disagree" and stated my opinion.

What I meant by average joe:
Is people like us. Not people like professional breeders. Was not meant to be an insult.
 

Mutt

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Here is some c/p from articles I have about fem'd seeds.

Feminized seeds occur as a result of stress, rather than genetics. All cannabis plants can and will make male flowers under stress. Certain strains like a higher pH, some a lower one. Some like a lot of food, some like much less. There is quite a lot of variety in marijuana genetics, and you can’t treat every plant the same way..........

I named this new method "Rodelization," after a friend who helped me realize and make use of this way of creating female seeds. After growing crop after crop of the same plants in the same conditions, I noticed that if I flowered the plants 10-14 days longer than usual, they would develop male "bananas." A male banana is a very slight male flower on a female marijuana plant that is formed because of stress. Usually they do not let out any pollen early enough to make seeds, but they sometimes do. They are a built-in safety factor so that in case of severe conditions, the plant can make sure the species is furthered.
RODELIZATION: SOMA'S WAY TO FEMALE SEEDS
Here’s an easy, environmentally friendly method for breeding feminized seeds.



Fixing Traits
Fixing traits (producing homozygous offspring) in Cannabis strains is more difficult than it is in many other flowering plants. With monoecious strains or hermaphrodites it is possible to fix traits by self-pollinating an individual exhibiting favorable traits. In this case one plant acts as both mother and father. However, most strains of Cannabis are dioecious, and unless hermaphroditic reactions can be induced, another parent exhibiting the trait is required to fix the trait. If this is not possible, the unique individual may be crossed with a plant not exhibiting the trait, inbred in the F1 generation, and selections of parents exhibiting the favorable trait made from the F2 generation, but this is very difficult.
If a trait is needed for development of a dioecious strain it might first be discovered in a monoecious strain and then fixed through selfing and selecting homozygous offspring. Dioecious individuals can then be selected from the monoecious population and these individuals crossed to breed out monoecism in subsequent generations.
Galoch (1978) indicated that gibberellic acid (GA3) promoted stamen production while indoleacetic acid (IAA), ethrel, and kinetin promoted pistil production in prefloral dioecious Cannabis. Sex alteration has several useful applications. Most importantly, if only one parent expressing a desirable trait can be found, it is difficult to perform a cross unless it happens to be a hermaphrodite plant. Hormones might be used to change the sex of a cutting from the desirable plant, and this cutting used to mate with it. This is most easily accomplished by changing a pistillate cutting to a staminate (pollen) parent, using a spray of 100 ppm gibberellic acid in water each day for five consecutive days. Within two weeks staminate flowers may appear. Pollen can then be collected for selfing with the original pistillate parent. Offspring from the cross should also be mostly pistillate since the breeder is selfing for pistillate sexuality. Staminate parents reversed to pistillate floral production make inferior seed-parents since few pistillate flowers and seeds are formed.
If entire crops could be manipulated early in life to produce all pistillate or staminate plants, seed production and seedless drug Cannabis production would be greatly facilitated.
Sex reversal for breeding can also be accomplished by mutilation and by photoperiod alteration. A well-rooted, flourishing cutting from the parent plant is pruned back to 25% of its original size and stripped of all its remaining flowers. New growth will appear within a few days, and several flowers of reversed sexual type often appear. Flowers of the unwanted sex are removed until the cutting is needed for fertilization. Extremely short light cycles (6-8 hour photoperiod) can also cause sex reversal. How ever, this process takes longer and is much more difficult to perform in the field.
Marijuana Botany
An Advanced Study: The Propagation and Breeding of Distinctive Cannabis
by Robert Connell Clarke

Here is another report with a section on "managable" and "unmanagable" hermaphrodite traits.
:: DJ Short presents ....
My Cataloguing System
 

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