LST Update: Uh-oh Chongo!

shadoed

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Hi everyone

Having some trouble with my oldest plant! A quick recap:

1. 7 weeks into veg
2. FF Ocean Forest soil with FF Grow Big
3. Soil pH 6.7-6.8
4. CFLs for vegging - lights on 24/0
5. Strain is unknown bagseed
6. Flushed 1 week ago

She was looking terrific until a few days ago when I started seeing what's in the pic. After working through the plant troubleshooter, it looks like too much N or not enough N to me, but I'm no expert. New growth on top is distinctly more yellow than the older growth. One thing I've noticed about LST is it gets very hard to water without getting some on the lower growth, so that may account for some of the brown spots, but not the new growth on top (??)

What to do?

I can give some additional pix or info if needed. Any and all opinions appreciated!

DSC01560_lo.jpg
 

Mutt

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Everything checks out. After looking at your veg. time and your troubles. 1 thing did jump out at me in the troubleshooter.

4) a) Leaves are browning or yellowing. Yellow, brown, or necrotic (dead) patches, especially around the edges of the leaf, which may be curled. Plant may be too tall. >> Potassium (K) deficiency.
7 week veg. she's gettin big.

Plus how is your water? is it hard with a high level of calcium? Might be worth a look see. Did it get worse AFTER the flush?

Potassium - Too much sodium (Na) displaces K, causing a K deficiency. Sources of high salinity are: baking soda (sodium bicarbonate "pH-up"), too much manure, and the use of water-softening filters (which should not be used). If the problem is Na, flush the soil. K can get locked up from too much Ca or ammonium nitrogen, and possibly cold weather.
I'd get your water tested.
If it is not really hard water, then the Ca could have built up over time. then after the flush it got bombarded with it.
 

shadoed

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yes, the water here has always been hard. Too much Ca, eh? Any way to fix this?
 

Mutt

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wikipedia said:
Temporary hardness, caused by hydrogen carbonate (or bicarbonate) ions, can be removed by boiling. For example, calcium hydrogen carbonate, often present in temporary hard water, is boiled in a kettle to remove the hardness. In the process, a scale forms on the inside of the kettle in a process known as "furring of kettles". This scale is composed of insoluble calcium carbonate.
Ca(HCO3)2 → CaCO3 + CO2 + H2O
Hardness can also be reduced with a lime-soda ash treatment. This process, developed by Thomas Clark in 1841, involves the addition of slaked lime (calcium hydroxide — Ca(OH)2) to a hard water supply to convert the hydrogen carbonate hardness to carbonate, which precipitates and can be removed by filtration:
Ca(HCO3)2 + Ca(OH)2 → 2CaCO3 + 2H2O
I would not use a "water softner" as everything I have read...they do not work well with plants.
I would try boiling the water first. of course letting it cool before you water the plants. If that don't do it try the soda ash tea.

The other alternative is to use store bought water. Like Spring Water. The PPM's are controlled.

I would also boost the P and K. Maybe a touch of bloom fert. Until you get the soil leached. I would wait for others to chime in though, This is just my thinking.
 

SPIDER-MAN

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i used to splash water on my plants when watering easy fix get a deck sprayer with the wand.it fits in easy and no water gets on your leaves
 

shadoed

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Thanks for that, Spidey. I've been using a funnel with a small length of hose attached. :p It's lo-tech but seems to do the trick.
 

ProductiveSmoker

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Sorry if this is a hijack, but why is it bad to get a little water on your plants when you are watering?
 

KADE

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It depends... but a 1000watt hps bulb will make the water droplets into little magnifying glasses that burn holes in the leaves.
 

shadoed

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I would think that an outdoor plant that got hit by the intense sun after a sunshower would have the same problem, but I'm darned if I've ever seen that in nature.

More to the point, though, ProductiveSmoker, I think I was seeing areas of my plant that got a little 'burned' because my water had nutes in it and the direct contact seemed to affect the leaves badly. That wouldn't account for the yellowing of the new growth on top, however. Mutt's explanation about the water hardness makes a lot of sense. I saw this same effect on my last(first) grow, where the plants were doing great right up to starting to flower, and then they were getting a lot of lower leaves turning brown, crisping up and dying off. It seems there is some 'critical mass' of calcium that builds up and then begins to kill the poor things. It appears much more pronounced this grow, for some reason. It's taking over the entire plant and I'm seriously doubting if she'll make it to bloom, much less to harvest.

I have two other plants I'm LSTing that are about three weeks behind the one in the pic and so far they show no signs of the Ca problem. Neither one has been flushed, which may explain why. I've begun boiling my water before using it (pain in the ***), but I was amazed at how much Ca precipitated out.
 

learnin to gro

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hey i just buy spring water from the store at .50 cents a gallon i think it is worth it
 

KADE

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shadoed said:
I would think that an outdoor plant that got hit by the intense sun after a sunshower would have the same problem, but I'm darned if I've ever seen that in nature.
The sun does do it... take the bottom of a broken beer bottle... and fill it with water... it can be used as a magnifying glass and WILL start fires... (go scouts!)
 

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