Caregivers lose BIG rights

[New_2_Chronic]

You guys are clouding the issues.... this discussion is not about the drugs, or prop 215, or against caregivers. Its about the case that was just won, and how it affects medicinal mj fight. The defination of a caregiver, and the responsibilities that come, or should come along with being a CG.

Newbie:

haha I think you are the one comparing apples to oranges. Caregivers are assisting in giving a medicine that although has incredible medicinal purposes, has the same risk as a tylenol... or less... lol

And where did you get your PHD from? Harvard I suppose.... I see you make no mention of the defination of a caregiver as it applies in Prop 215.

And you are way out in left field with your statement.... MJ is not as harmless as a tylonel if used wrongly. What do you think would happen if you gave a severely depressed person a Indica as a medicinal therapy. You take "Caregiver" way to lightly. There is much more to know about supplying meds than just how to grow... You have to know WHAT to grow, and dosages, which can only be acheived through education.

I definately wouldnt want you as my caregiver thats for sure......

 

[NorCalHal]

Thanks Chronic, great convo, very interesting.

I see your point on this statement, And I guess it is that right in which this forum was based on and the reason we re all here. Freedom to do what, when, and how you want in the privacy of your own home or faciity should be kept sacred and noone has the right to dictate what a person can and cant do. As long as you are not endangering yourself or anyone else then its sacred,,,,

But Ive yet to see a operation that size not "robbing power" or bringing an unsavory element around.

Thats what MMJ, to me, is all about. Freedom. Legalization. "Don't Tread on me". MJ Prohabition does not work. So, we agree that What you do is your business aside from endangering yurself or others.

The biggest MJ ops do not even use power at all, it's all outdoor in Beloved Humbolt. So why can't Hippy Joe grow his 1000 plants, like they do every year for generations and not fear Prison time.

But, I do see your point in Big Indoor crops. I must say that I too have seen "unsavory" uses of power. But, the main reason power is used like that is to keep the higher usage "off the grid" and avoid detection by LEO.
Folks would GLADLY pay for power if it was legal and had no worries anout LEO and how many, or how big they went.

The "unsavory" element, which I see too, is still a cause of supply and demand. These are all new cats who are in to make a fast buck and mostly fail due to ignorance. But, you have that dumb "gangsta" in most wokplaces today, sad to say.

Basicly....IMO...Yes..... someone that supplies herb for money is a Pot dealer. I mean I know there is no way the grower is spending anywhere near the price they charge per ounce to grow it....I can see recovering the costs of growing, and getting some free smoke out of the deal but they are going well beyond that.

Whats fair? The grower is getting FAR less then what the Dispensay is charging patients, that is for sure. But what is mark-up? Most products are marked up 100 to 500%, Herb is less then that. And, as stated, if it wasn't for growers supplying herb to dispensaries, then over 100,000 folks would be back on the street in California alone trying to buy herb from REAL unsavory folks.
Believe me, I do also think the end user price for herb is crazy. I see 65 an eigth in clubs. But I see 15 eights of good outdoor too. Supply and Demand.

I thnk the term they used in 215 is what is causing the problems here. They used the term Caregiver, which implies a step beyond what the task actually is.

Standards hmm... how about the Caregiver must be involved in the patients treament beyond just growing and supplying MJ for them. That could be that the "CG" provides or arranges transportation for treatments and appointments.....Could also be that the CG is responsible for picking up prescriptions and delivering them to the patient...The CG should also not be able to profit from the patient. Recovering costs for growing equiptment and nutrients is okay but that should be it. This could be done as a recurring monthly charge for the patient....There should be a limit of plants per patient the CG is responsible for, and it should be closely monitored.....There should also be a limit to the amount of patients per CG....

Your obviously a GREAT guy. I completly understand your argument here.
And yes, a "CG", by definition and commen sense, is a person that really provides care, not herb. But, unfortunaly that term "CG" was exploited for the greater cause , Full Legalization. Isn't that what we are ALL after?

Chronic, wouldn't you like to see Full Legalization. No limits one can have or grow. I know man, it would be CRAZY for a while and everyone would try, but it would "weed" itself out and true growers would prosper and Herb would get better and better.

Maybe I'm crazy man. But I like to smoke herb rather then Drink or do drugs. I have been doing so a long time. I see Beer comercials and drug comercials all the time. Fully accepted. I think MJ should be right there too. No friggin restrictions just like Alcohol gets. Set an age limit and let er rip.

 

[HydroManiac]

What i see is it really doesnt depend on indica or sativa as to how it is grown and treated knowing that im bi polar has nothing to do with it if you are being treated with medical marijuana should be fully honest this is just like any other PRESCRIBE MEDICINE you dont treat a virus with a antibiotic. AND FOR THE RECORD Marijuana is a depressent not a anti depressent other drugs would be known as a anti depressent which i will not name for say the rules of this form

AND ALSO FOR THE RECORD MY FAMILYS LINEAGE HAS GOT THERE MEDICAL DEGREES AT HOWARD UNIVERSITY MEDICAL SCHOOL PROGRESSING THREE GENERATIONS

 

[New_2_Chronic]

Whats fair? The grower is getting FAR less then what the Dispensay is charging patients, that is for sure. But what is mark-up? Most products are marked up 100 to 500%, Herb is less then that. And, as stated, if it wasn't for growers supplying herb to dispensaries, then over 100,000 folks would be back on the street in California alone trying to buy herb from REAL unsavory folks.
Believe me, I do also think the end user price for herb is crazy. I see 65 an eigth in clubs. But I see 15 eights of good outdoor too. Supply and Demand.

I totaly agree with you.... but Cg's are usually growing for patients not dispenceries. I think the CG's should only be able to mark up say below 100% for sure, i was thinking 15%. that should more than make up for any grwing expenses Plus they get free smoke. I just dont want to see the CG's screwing the patients.....thats all....

I dont know how dispenceries are regulated so i cant comment. Is there any regulations to how much they can mark up product? Or are they free to set thier own prices.

 

[New_2_Chronic]

What i see is it really doesnt depend on indica or sativa as to how it is grown and treated knowing that im bi polar has nothing to do with it if you are being treated with medical marijuana should be fully honest this is just like any other PRESCRIBE MEDICINE you dont treat a virus with a antibiotic. AND FOR THE RECORD Marijuana is a depressent not a anti depressent other drugs would be known as a anti depressent which i will not name for say the rules of this form

AND ALSO FOR THE RECORD MY FAMILYS LINEAGE HAS GOT THERE MEDICAL DEGREES AT HOWARD UNIVERSITY MEDICAL SCHOOL PROGRESSING THREE GENERATIONS

HM Your family sounds more than qualified....But your statement shows just how much you know about using MJ in a medicinal regimen. Im no expert in MMJ but I do know what strains are beneficial and wether i need a indica or sativa to treat my different moods. If im in a depressed mood i knw i need a sativa to lift me up, if im having a psychotic Rage episode i know i need a couchlock indica to throw me down and keep me sedated for awhile....All of this has been gained by experimentation and guaging the effects...

You odviously dont know anything about dosage as well. Your probably one of those people who think, you cant overdose on MJ. You most certainly can, and when it is taken with food its even harder to get the dosage right. Yes it wont kill you but I made some butter that really mucked me up and made me feel very very badly for awhile....Try it if you dont believe me.....

 

[HydroManiac]

like i said from what ive learned it depends on the grow chronic as much as the trich colors but that is only a rumor

 

[New_2_Chronic]

like i said from what ive learned it depends on the grow chronic as much as the trich colors but that is only a rumor

you are confusing "when to harvest" with "what to grow, strain, family, ect"

 

[HydroManiac]

from what i know white strains are the most medical strains and ive never heard of someone treating depression with marijuana

 

[NewbieG]

I'm guessing it would probably make them more depressed... they would notice this and stop taking it... just like caffeine can make kids who are already hyper more hyper. I realize the risk that the individual may take their life exists, but I think people think in this world so maybe its not SO extreme?

You guys are clouding the issues.... this discussion is not about the drugs, or prop 215, or against caregivers. Its about the case that was just won, and how it affects medicinal mj fight. The defination of a caregiver, and the responsibilities that come, or should come along with being a CG.

Newbie:


And where did you get your PHD from? Harvard I suppose.... I see you make no mention of the defination of a caregiver as it applies in Prop 215.

And you are way out in left field with your statement.... MJ is not as harmless as a tylonel if used wrongly. What do you think would happen if you gave a severely depressed person a Indica as a medicinal therapy. You take "Caregiver" way to lightly. There is much more to know about supplying meds than just how to grow... You have to know WHAT to grow, and dosages, which can only be acheived through education.

I definately wouldnt want you as my caregiver thats for sure......

 

[NewbieG]

HM Your family sounds more than qualified....But your statement shows just how much you know about using MJ in a medicinal regimen. Im no expert in MMJ but I do know what strains are beneficial and wether i need a indica or sativa to treat my different moods. If im in a depressed mood i knw i need a sativa to lift me up, if im having a psychotic Rage episode i know i need a couchlock indica to throw me down and keep me sedated for awhile....All of this has been gained by experimentation and guaging the effects...

You odviously dont know anything about dosage as well. Your probably one of those people who think, you cant overdose on MJ. You most certainly can, and when it is taken with food its even harder to get the dosage right. Yes it wont kill you but I made some butter that really mucked me up and made me feel very very badly for awhile....Try it if you dont believe me.....

Thats the difference between other drugs and weed... Weed makes you feel "mucky" when other drugs kill you I think you are taking "caregiver" too far. The way you want it a caregiver would be needed for each patient to meet all the disabled persons needs... your definition would completely change things.

 

[New_2_Chronic]

all great points.... I see validity in all that was said here.....

im not taking caregiver too far I just think that a CG should bear a little more responsibility in the true spirit of the word. I never said tat a CG should handle ALL a persons needs, just more than being the weedman......

 

[The Effen Gee]

Putting my heart, soul blood, and sweat into my crops while undercutting the market by almost criminal margins...

I have no problems sleeping at night.

Screw the dispenceries...come see Gee.

 

[Wiseguy_Chef]

thies grows, are not cartel, its mexican mafia, an northast family doing thies grows with in the usa. the cartel's don't work that way. just cuz u here one thing one the news don't make it true. i lived the life i know what gos on out there. drugs run all, TJ cartle ant **** anymore, they don't have the infulnice to move in to the usa an start growing stuff. MM would wipem off the map buddy an get there cocain else where. like the jarzar cartal wich runs pretty much all the cocain an mexican brick in the usa.

 

[godspeedsuckah]

are u rasitest or just retarted, since u can't say it, mexicans grow there weed south of the border. most of your 5000 plant oups are being ran by white people with big money ok, so don't be going on with rasist stuff, i am hispanic, an hate the drug wars. but the people distoying your hills are your own people!!!!

So I guess the real question is are YOU retarded. You can try calling me a racist it won't work, you bigot, I hate everyone equally!!!

 

[HydroManiac]

where did this come from I NEVER SLEEP BUHAHAHA

 

[NorCalHal]

thies grows, are not cartel, its mexican mafia, an northast family doing thies grows with in the usa. the cartel's don't work that way. just cuz u here one thing one the news don't make it true. i lived the life i know what gos on out there. drugs run all, TJ cartle ant **** anymore, they don't have the infulnice to move in to the usa an start growing stuff. MM would wipem off the map buddy an get there cocain else where. like the jarzar cartal wich runs pretty much all the cocain an mexican brick in the usa.

I believe he is correct, it's all the Southerners (Scraps as we like to call em') There is a difference in Cartels to MM. Still, they are of mexican nationality....who do not live in the US legally.

I totaly agree with you.... but Cg's are usually growing for patients not dispenceries. I think the CG's should only be able to mark up say below 100% for sure, i was thinking 15%. that should more than make up for any grwing expenses Plus they get free smoke. I just dont want to see the CG's screwing the patients.....thats all....

I dont know how dispenceries are regulated so i cant comment. Is there any regulations to how much they can mark up product? Or are they free to set thier own prices.

How the dispensaries operate is under the "caregiver" premice. That is why I feel the call the Cali Supreme court ruled is a negitive. This "could" push the sales to med patients bakc on the streets, which is wrong.

There is no regulations governing price, it is simple Supply and Demand. Harder strains to grow with less yield (Kush, purps) go for higher prices then some BlueBerry grown in huge quantities outdoor, for instance. I know man, you read about these HIGH prices for herb in the clubs, but it is the TOP strains and Grown to perfection. which is fetching these prices. And trust me, it is the MINORITY of herb at these places. There is PLENTY of GREAT herb at clubs for under $40 an eigth. So, don't think they are just robbin' folks, Shoot, the Patients have the choice of what to buy.
Now, if it went back to the Street, multiple choices and price ranges would dissapear.

 

[SmokinMom]

Watch your words here guys. This is an interesting read and I'd hate to see it get closed due to folks not getting along.

Carry on- nicely.

 

[New_2_Chronic]

Hey MOM, I see no arguments happening here,,,, just good solid convo with different views......JMO though,,,,,

EDIT: Sorry MOM i see what your talking about......

Lets all play nice, Id hate to see such a productive thread go south......


Thanks NorCal, Let me ask you this. are all the dispenceries charging the same amount for the herb, for instance, is an eigth of purps the same no matter what dispencery you go to? Or is it possible you spend 80 at on place, and 60 at another?

 

[New_2_Chronic]

How the dispensaries operate is under the "caregiver" premice. That is why I feel the call the Cali Supreme court ruled is a negitive. This "could" push the sales to med patients bakc on the streets, which is wrong.

Ding Ding Ding..... Now this I did not know,,,, Had no idea the Disp. are operating under the "Caregiver" status. I thought the dispenceries were just that and were governed another way. I thought the CG was for joe schmo that wanted to grow a few plants for mmj patients, so they would not have to deal with dispenceries.

 

[NewbieG]

all great points.... I see validity in all that was said here.....

im not taking caregiver too far I just think that a CG should bear a little more responsibility in the true spirit of the word. I never said tat a CG should handle ALL a persons needs, just more than being the weedman......

I agree with you here. I want to become one when I graduate from College. I plan on also providing other services such as organic vegetables and meats for meals after I assist them in taking their medicine. I figured it would be good for the sick to get a good healthy meal in them depending on their illness.
But this new law would change that completely. Instead of being able to provide great services to 10+, 20+, 100+ people, CG will only be able to provide services for a few because of the increased time of dedication needed for each individual patient. Having to drive them, accompany them to appointments, prepare meals, etc, will limit CG to patient ratios drastically. The profession is either going to go under, or become a service only for those with alot of money, because I don't think insurance is going to cover it lol. One person cannot be a caregiver as you want them to be, AND grow, AND have several other patients. So now how are the caregivers going to make a living? I think we're going to see a HUGE leap to co-ops, or people just going back into hiding or staying at an illegal status because of it. No doubt growing medical marijuana is a lucrative business, and people will use this law to cheat and sell illegally, but just because its being used wrong in some cases, it shouldn't be completely altered as it was. Maybe I'm misunderstanding what happened, but it sounds like they are trying to make it a 3-1 patient to care giver ratio sorta thing.