Bagseed Conniption Fit

[MootPointBlank]

Okay, I just finished building my indoor grow system a couple of months ago and to test the setup I used some bagseed from middies. I can't even begin to describe to you the frustration that I've experienced in trying to cultivate this stuff. Every aspect of this grow has been scrutinized until each environmental condition was made ideal. Still, they wither and die. Is it just that the bagseed is most likely an outdoor strain or just crappy genetics to begin with? Can anyone shed some light on this? I have some good genetics that I plan on using but I wanted to make sure I have everything just right before I use them and the abysmal results from this bagseed is causing me to hesitate. Anyone? Anyone?

MPB

 

[Shockeclipse]

Whats your setup like? Type/size of light? Temps? Grow space size? Nutrients. We are going to need more information to help. Describe your setup, then describe the steps you took before it failed and mayne then we can help.

 

[SmokinAce]

ostpicsworthless:

...and way more descriptive information.

marijuanapassion.com/forum/showthread.php?t=25182

 

[MootPointBlank]

Okay, I'll try to make this quick.

Dual chamber cabinet, 4sq ft/chamber. 400W MH on one side, 400W HPS on the other. Lumatek Digital ballasts. White walls. Vented airflow bottom to top. Internal temps during on ~80F and off ~68F. Using BMO ferts in 10gal Rubbermaid tubs. DWC using 4gal of nutes aerated by Tetra100 with 12" airstone, plus each plant tube has it's own air feed. Clones from potted bagseed females in rockwool over rinsed hydroton. pH stays around 6.4 since all attempts at adjustment have failed otherwise. No bugs, no algae. I'm not so worried about saving these as I am interested in hearing what people have to say about using bagseed vs. designer strains in general.

MPB

 

[Jibber]

Too stong of Nutes/ferts???

Typically you have to cut the recomended dosages in half.

Explain how they "die." Do they get wilty, change colors, dry out,.....etc....

 

[mrkingford]

This will be an interesting post to follow, as i am growing bag weed as a first timer with NOWHERE near the set up you have!
After 1 week i have 10 little plants.
They seem to be healthy and growing, good luck on your next grow.

 

[Jibber]

How long do they last before they die?

Are they dying as clones?

 

[HippyInEngland]

I'm not so worried about saving these as I am interested in hearing what people have to say about using bagseed vs. designer strains in general.

Bagseed are great to grow and learn with.

Once you grow your own quality genetics you will understand why people mention it.

Its poinless me trying to explain what a gooseberry tastes like if the other person only knows what a plum tastes like.



eace:

 

[zipflip]

i bet ya've wondered how come weed costs so much thinkin, "how hard could it be to grow a plant?" huh?

 

[pcduck]

Just from what you have written I would say. The ph is way to high, and need better air circulation/ventulation.

 

[Shockeclipse]

I'm with PC on this, lower your ph. I am ranging mine from 5.6-6.1. 5.8 is optimal. Whats your water temp and ppms? Temps are a little high at 80 but not enough to kill your plants.

 

[MootPointBlank]

Since it would take too long to reply to each individually, which, by the way, thanks for all of your input, I'm going to address all in one. Technically, none of them have died yet, they just seem to be performing like zombies. Bottom to top yellowing of leaves, necrotic patching and burnt tips, purple stems, twisted leaves, eventually all fan leaves have shriveled and died, elongated node growth, 80% went hermie of original five in pots. Clones in DWC are beginning to show same issues. Just changed nutes and modified grow design slightly, guess we'll see what happens. pH on this batch is a bit low (4.7) this round but I expect it to climb overnight so I'll check again tomorrow. Apparently, TDS on organic nutes is worthless because organic doesn't have the concentration of heavy metals that chem do, which give you your accurate reading. I don't know how much I believe it yet but it would make sense given the readings that I've gotten. I mixed this batch at half the recommended dose into 5gal RO. Not much left for me to do. As for increasing ventilation, I'm at max capacity as it is with my AC at 76F and a portable AC in the room running 24/7 on 68F. The on temps fluctuate from 77F to 82F on average but seem to sit right at 80F most of the time.

And, yeah, it's a weed, it shouldn't be that difficult.

MPB

 

[pcduck]

With the ph swings that your girls are enduring no wonder they are dying.

I would suggest you read this.

 

[JBonez]

not often enough people like pcduck go out of their way to help, very nice!

Great advice btw.

 

[MootPointBlank]

With the ph swings that your girls are enduring no wonder they are dying.

I would suggest you read this.

Yes, I remember this guide. It has some really good info, but nothing I haven't read elsewhere. It would seem that I've developed a case of "grower's block". I haven't found what's holding up this grow yet, but hopefully I will soon. Later this afternoon I'll be able to check in on them and then I'll post my findings. Thanks again all for bearing with me here through this rough patch.

MPB

 

[The Hemp Goddess]

... I haven't found what's holding up this grow yet, but hopefully I will soon. ....

MPB

I'm with pcduck--It is your pH.

There is little doubt in my mind that your wide pH flucuations are what is causing your problems. Your pH is way off the radar. A pH of 4.7 isn't a bit low, it is extremely low. A pH of 6.4 isn't a little high, it is way high. Until you get your pH in line, nothing else you do is going to matter. PH in a DWC needs to be kept between about 5.5 and 6.0. Since the pH scale is an expotential scale like the Richter scale, what might seem like small differences are really big differences.

I see no mention of your PPMs--what are you running at?

 

[Super Silver Haze]

i agree with PH being off. also, when you adjust your PH only make small changes at a time.... 0.1 point per day.

 

[MootPointBlank]

So, I dumped the old nutes, cleaned out the res, modified the "net pots" for better aeration and poured in the new stuff. Remember how it pH'd at 4.7 only yesterday? I just checked it a few minutes ago and it's already at 6.5. I wholeheartedly agree with you guys that it's pH. But I don't know what else to do. Every time I adjust it it just shoots right back up again and the fluctuations, I'm afraid, are doing more damage than just having it out of range. What can I do to buffer it so that it stays in range? I'm using this sulfuric acid based stuff for ponds and aquariums that I found in the pet store, but apparently it's not very stable.

MPB

P.S. My ppm's, for what it's worth, are around 225 with a .5 conversion factor.

 

[pcduck]

I use GH PH UP and Down. After I adjust after adding my nutes and ph adjuster I aerate my nutes for 24 hours then readjust if needed, seems like it will creep up the first 24 hours then level off. Then I put in my solution into my buckets at 5.8 by weeks end it has gone to 6.0-6.1 usually.

 

[Cannabiscotti]

i quickly read through the posts and didnt notice if it had been said, but you can root clones in just water. the PH was/is def the problem, but you can go without nutes for the beginning--might help stabalize the PH.

is there anything in the air (ie: sulfer,etc) that could be going through the air pumps that may effect the PH?