BML spider 600

techrons78

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Any thoughts on this...I mite purchase next 6 months or so looks like a great fixture..Osram leds built to order...36" arms 3 feet long no fan poly carbonate shell..
 

Grower13

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Any thoughts on this...I mite purchase next 6 months or so looks like a great fixture..Osram leds built to order...36" arms 3 feet long no fan poly carbonate shell..

I'm not going to pay 1500 for any light.............
 

Dr. Green Fang

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Spyder is next level, according to "things" :D

... at least is seems!
 

techrons78

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You asked for thoughts........ you got mine.
Im sorry I forgot to add to answer with something intelligent , you see no value in it..so of course you say no..expensive yes..get what you pay for yes...whats is gonna crack me up if these fly by night led companies people are buying in one years or syou they start breaking down..from growing better light more par more lumen ... can u go wrong..will pay for itself over time with electricity and supposedly onky light to cover 4x4..im into making money investing in good equipment...are you gonna put your wife in a, cheap unsafe car..or woukd u rather get her the McLaren Mercedes.....I like the finer things I see first hand difference from my apollo lights ti kind...world difference..
 

techrons78

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One thing I like sbout them is no fan polycarbonate shell adjustable arms...the arms makecsince...with most led u need several fixture light is soocfocused. .but u branch out arms like an, umbrella everything gets par n lumens
 

Dr. Green Fang

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Yeah, the Spyder stuff is top of the line LED right now.

As for world of difference Kind vs Apollo... let's see some Par readings :D
I saw the Kind light I almost got, at the hydro store the other day. Didn't fancy it..

The BML stuff though, now THAT is next level! :)
 

techrons78

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Yeah, the Spyder stuff is top of the line LED right now.

As for world of difference insiind vs Apollo... let's see some Par readings :D
I saw the Kind light I almost got, at the hydro store the other day. Didn't fancy it..

The BML stuff though, now THAT is next level! :)
If I had par meter id give you one..but apollo wont put out par usually and wont give proof of daid Bridgelux leds ..if u want more info u can pm..but I have grown with both..I was sushi the apollo p8 its very bright but I guarantee the foods are close if not to full capacity..interodes were longer with apollo and was using advanced led ..switch to kind...has greens in it like the tech they are using in outerspacec tp grow my interodes are tight...im sure it won heightened last year for a reason..but I will find out in 7 weeks lol
 
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The only light better IMHO is the BML 1200 which crushes the Gavita's at half the wattage.

A bit rich for my blood, but if they were half I'd replace my entire setup with zero hesitation.
 

NorCalHal

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I definitely wouldn't say it crushes the Gavita's at half wattage. That BML runs at 670 watts as compared to 1000, my math tells me it is saving you approx. 330 watts.

I wouldn't go by the comparision that 1 video, in a poorly designed room, shows. I am basing my opinion on the DE bulbs from my own experience with them.

Again, some folks still go by the old skool method of measuring success by grams per watt, when the true test is grams per square foot. Any Professional in the MJ Industry will tell you it is all about the grams per square foot.

The BML light does have me interested, but the price point makes it unfeasible at the moment.
 
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I definitely wouldn't say it crushes the Gavita's at half wattage. That BML runs at 670 watts as compared to 1000, my math tells me it is saving you approx. 330 watts.

I wouldn't go by the comparision that 1 video, in a poorly designed room, shows. I am basing my opinion on the DE bulbs from my own experience with them.

With how much experience with LED tech?

Again, some folks still go by the old skool method of measuring success by grams per watt, when the true test is grams per square foot. Any Professional in the MJ Industry will tell you it is all about the grams per square foot.

Actually, guys I know go by cost to produce said grams.

The BML light does have me interested, but the price point makes it unfeasible at the moment.
One video? Old school method? I been crushing HPS numbers for three years straight and ran HPS tech for 30+ years before that.

Lets not forget that the one of the most important factors is time, and because you can make plants larger with HPS you can do more because of this and that is the ONLY benefit. At the end of the day your cost I am willing to bet is twice my cost all things considered.

All things the same and a 14 to 21 days veg and I crush HPS at less than half the wattage and I really don't care what brand you want to compare it to. My average finish time from root to done is 83 to 92 days on every strain I run.

You may be able to achieve 1GPW with HPS but no way you do it on plants vegged 14 to 21 days, and at the end of the day all that really matter is how much it costs to produce said grams.

I am also using about half the power to cool, and half the cost to feed which also factors in.

I'll stand by orginal comment that good LED tech crushes the Gavita or any HPS for that matter. We can agree to disagree, but facts is facts.

How bout this?

One of us shares a strain. I will use one my designed 180 watt lights, and you can use a 400 watt HPS so we keep it small scale and we do a comparison grow, you know just for fun. 2 gallon pot max.

We veg for 21 days and flip and document it all. You can use as much space as you like.

Whatcha think?

I'll define crush and we'll open up a few closed eyes around here.

Also FWIW, if my lights were for sale I could cover 3 times the space for the cost of the Spydr's, so yeah we'll agree on their price point for sure, but there are other lights out there that crush it.
 

NorCalHal

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One video? Old school method? I been crushing HPS numbers for three years straight and ran HPS tech for 30+ years before that.

Lets not forget that the one of the most important factors is time, and because you can make plants larger with HPS you can do more because of this and that is the ONLY benefit. At the end of the day your cost I am willing to bet is twice my cost all things considered.

All things the same and a 14 to 21 days veg and I crush HPS at less than half the wattage and I really don't care what brand you want to compare it to. My average finish time from root to done is 83 to 92 days on every strain I run.

You may be able to achieve 1GPW with HPS but no way you do it on plants vegged 14 to 21 days, and at the end of the day all that really matter is how much it costs to produce said grams.

I am also using about half the power to cool, and half the cost to feed which also factors in.

I'll stand by orginal comment that good LED tech crushes the Gavita or any HPS for that matter. We can agree to disagree, but facts is facts.

How bout this?

One of us shares a strain. I will use one my designed 180 watt lights, and you can use a 400 watt HPS so we keep it small scale and we do a comparison grow, you know just for fun. 2 gallon pot max.

We veg for 21 days and flip and document it all. You can use as much space as you like.

Whatcha think?

I'll define crush and we'll open up a few closed eyes around here.

Also FWIW, if my lights were for sale I could cover 3 times the space for the cost of the Spydr's, so yeah we'll agree on their price point for sure, but there are other lights out there that crush it.

Sure are testy for an old man haha.

I based my comments on the Video posted about the commercial LED grow, not your grows. We all know you are the master of LED tech. I am not challenging your authority. ( I love South Park).


Thanks for the grow off invite, but I have outgrown my closet my friend. I simply do not have the time, or the need to document grows anymore. Do not take this as I am scared my friend, I just have a business to run.

The most I veg on my plants is 21 days, from rooted clone, I am not sure why you think this is an exceptional time frame to Veg, it seems normal to me. I too hit on average around 80 daze...yes....80 daze. That is correct, and not a typo. I cut like clockwork 56-60 days from flip. Last hit averaged 1.36 gpw for those stuck in the 90's method of measuring success. Besides...we both can agree that strain is the number one factor in weight per plant/watt/grow area.

Remember, Commercial environments are ALOT different then home grows. Think about co2 and the impact it has on veg times and flower times. Think about sub sonic wave harmonizers and the impact it has on the stomata.


Yes, cost per gram for finished product is, I am sure, lower then what I achieve. I have horrible power bills due to cooling and wattage, but it all washes out in the end. I am not greedy, so I don't complain. I keep myself and my employee's very happy.

As far as cost of nuits, I am probably lower then most. Less then $300 to grow 30+ lbs. That pretty low imho. I am in the Mecca of commercial growing, I know many commercial growers. No one I know bases there herb on what it costs to grow per gram, just sayin'. It's all about weight out of area. True costs per gram for me would make you cry. Taxes/wages/fees/rent/power...to name a few. That's why commercial growers grow commercially haha....we HAVE to go big or go under.

So, end all be all, don't get so upset when someone disagrees with you bro. Believe, you or I have not seen anything yet. The Industry is changing faster then any other and all tech has it's place.
 

NorCalHal

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And Yes PJ, I have zero experience with LED tech, and that should be known.
I am just going off the posts yourself and other do on the tech.
I have only seen a couple of live LED grows myself. Definitely impressive in the environment it was in.
I have much respect for you PJ, so don't take any of this personally, I just gotta say what I gotta say too. Maybe I poke too much, but I figure you can take it.
You and I BOTH know that the lights are only a small part of success, as method truly dictates skill.
All I am saying is Gavita's have their place, and they are keeping up with LED tech in the right hands. If LED was right for me and what I am doing, I would have changed already.

I must say that regular HPS should be discontinued. It's simple. Smaller environment...LED. Bigger Enviroment...DE.

Again, I see LED tech trying to get into the Commercial market, and I APPLAUD it. Once costs go down, it could have an impact. But, for me, cost is not the only factor.
Ease of use too. Having a big area lit with less fixtures is nice. If there was one giant LED that attached to the ceiling and lit the whole room crazy style, I'd be all over it, whatever the cost haha.

Believe me, I'm not out here spinnin' my wheels, I have one big advantage over most folks, I have an open mind. That is the one big mistake I see ALL growers go though, a closed mind. Why do you think I surf the 'net on grow sites. It's robbery, that's why. I will steal your idea with the quickness! But of course, the idea has to make sense and work.


btw....I'd love to throw u something to see how she grows under your skills and those lights. Can I say that?
 
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Sure are testy for an old man haha.
hahaha, didn't think the challenge would come across as Testy, but thought rather it would allow you to opened up to the idea that perhaps there is something to this whole LED thing.

Thanks for the grow off invite, but I have outgrown my closet my friend. I simply do not have the time, or the need to document grows anymore. Do not take this as I am scared my friend, I just have a business to run.

Not sure if you think I am a closet grower, but I harvest 52 times a year. It may be a smaller system in terms of size as I am not a commercial grower, but my runs are computer controlled using the very latest in tech, including CO2.


The most I veg on my plants is 21 days, from rooted clone, I am not sure why you think this is an exceptional time frame to Veg, it seems normal to me. I too hit on average around 80 daze...yes....80 daze. That is correct, and not a typo. I cut like clockwork 56-60 days from flip. Last hit averaged 1.36 gpw for those stuck in the 90's method of measuring success. Besides...we both can agree that strain is the number one factor in weight per plant/watt/grow area.

We will agree that the strain has a lot to do with it which is why I wanted to run the same strain to show you I'd do better at half the wattage. I would have had to set up a space as well.

Remember, Commercial environments are ALOT different then home grows. Think about co2 and the impact it has on veg times and flower times. Think about sub sonic wave harmonizers and the impact it has on the stomata.

So then we are even and it would be a fair test.


Yes, cost per gram for finished product is, I am sure, lower then what I achieve. I have horrible power bills due to cooling and wattage, but it all washes out in the end. I am not greedy, so I don't complain. I keep myself and my employee's very happy.

As far as cost of nuits, I am probably lower then most. Less then $300 to grow 30+ lbs. That pretty low imho. I am in the Mecca of commercial growing, I know many commercial growers. No one I know bases there herb on what it costs to grow per gram, just sayin'. It's all about weight out of area. True costs per gram for me would make you cry. Taxes/wages/fees/rent/power...to name a few. That's why commercial growers grow commercially haha....we HAVE to go big or go under.

So, end all be all, don't get so upset when someone disagrees with you bro. Believe, you or I have not seen anything yet. The Industry is changing faster then any other and all tech has it's place.
I am not upset. I feel you have nothing but opinions to share on LED tech and made the statement that LED's could not crush a Gavita watt for watt. I say you are wrong, and wanted to show it. Nothing more nothing less.

And Yes PJ, I have zero experience with LED tech, and that should be known.
I am just going off the posts yourself and other do on the tech.
I have only seen a couple of live LED grows myself. Definitely impressive in the environment it was in.
I have much respect for you PJ, so don't take any of this personally, I just gotta say what I gotta say too. Maybe I poke too much, but I figure you can take it.

Totally, I'm also willing to put up or shut up about the claims I make and am willing to take on any HPS grower on the planet and if someone wanted to teach me something I'd take them up on it.

You and I BOTH know that the lights are only a small part of success, as method truly dictates skill.

Yup, which is why I suggested we share and run the same strain.

All I am saying is Gavita's have their place, and they are keeping up with LED tech in the right hands. If LED was right for me and what I am doing, I would have changed already.

Had you followed up with me back in July you would have had the opportunity to run some of my LED's to test. Not sure if you have your product tested, but you could have done that also and seen on average that LED flowers of the same strain is improved with LED lighting. This is now being shown and documented on the net.


I must say that regular HPS should be discontinued. It's simple. Smaller environment...LED. Bigger Enviroment...DE.

Again, I see LED tech trying to get into the Commercial market, and I APPLAUD it. Once costs go down, it could have an impact. But, for me, cost is not the only factor.
Ease of use too. Having a big area lit with less fixtures is nice.

If there was one giant LED that attached to the ceiling and lit the whole room crazy style, I'd be all over it, whatever the cost haha.

Already exists.
For the life of me can not remember the name of the grow, but it's documented on Youtube. Just searched with no luck...

Believe me, I'm not out here spinnin' my wheels, I have one big advantage over most folks, I have an open mind. That is the one big mistake I see ALL growers go though, a closed mind. Why do you think I surf the 'net on grow sites. It's robbery, that's why. I will steal your idea with the quickness! But of course, the idea has to make sense and work.


btw....I'd love to throw u something to see how she grows under your skills and those lights. Can I say that?
Throw me a PM.

Of course we are good. We go back quite a ways and I hope the respect is mutual. I really wasn't trying to be testy. For whatever reason you think gavita's will hold their own against LED's watt for watt. I say you have nothing to base this on except opinion so I threw out a way for you and the rest of this site to see it first hand.

Peace
 

Dr. Green Fang

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I really wasn't trying to be testy
Really, he wasn't...

...the prick just comes off that way sometimes :rofl:

I love and respect both you guys....but I'd jab the SH!T out of PJ's ribs if I meet him in real life! Then buy him a beer :D
PJ's changed the way I do everything, and for my larger / small operation, things seem to be for the better. Can't wait to see how the next few months go!

PJ, NorCal, Hush, THG, etc etc.. there's so many of you I'd like to meet outside of "behind your keyboard" :)
 
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