So, im counting my days wrong....and why I think im right.

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Lesso

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I have been politely informed by a visitor to my grow journal that i am wrongly counting the days of my flowering plants. Apparently by counting " day 1" as the first day i switch the lighting cycle to 12 hours on/off, my calendar is inaccurate . I paraphrase here, "Your plants didnt show signs of flowering until about 7 to 10 days into the cycle...that should be day 1. When you see sure signs that your plants have ACTUALLY started flowering."

According to this source, i am shortchanging my harvest due to taking down my plants too early. The following are reasons i respectfully disagree and believe i am right in counting the way i do.

1. There needs be an objective way of counting the days your plants are in flower. There can be several reasons for this, the main one i im concerned with would be estimated harvest time projection and nutrient schedules.

2. Counting from "the first signs of flower" is too nebulous and subjective to be useful for predictive projections. One could then possibly further divide this method by a myriad of other subjective criteria; such as when the plants begin to stretch, or when pistil productions become apparent, etc. The main problem with this methodology is the subjective nature of the observer. The observer may not immediately notice the beginning of stretch or pistil production. They may be free to make post hoc observations, thus inaccurately counting by a week or more.

3. I do not make final harvest decisions based on the number of days the plant has been in flower. I use the widely accepted method of trichome quality assessment. I may have to take a plant early if there are signs of hermaphrodites, pests, or complications from a number of different quality reducing stressors.

My conclusion is that the only quantifiable way of counting your flower cycle timing is from the day you have changed photo periods. That is the only non subjective factor in the equation.
Opinions?
 
Some breeders use the timing from when you see flowering to begin, more because it makes their strains look like their flowering cycle is shorter than it really is, to sell beans. Flowering times should only be a guide. If growing out some F2 beans, you will see a wide variety of phenotype expression, including different flowering times. The range might be, 8 to 10 weeks with the majority within the 1st standard deviation of 64% in the middle of the range, and about 18% at either extreme. Within the range of pheno expression might include yield, THC levels, terpene development, height, spread, branching patterns, ect. However, the shortest and the longest flowering strains may not even have the attributes you are searching for. None of this is quantifiable per se, its more about reading the plant and not the breeder hype.
 
Actually, I have always thought that the breeders' flowering times were only estimates and are based on very well dialed in grow rooms...so counting the exact days doesn't really matter anyway. Any experienced grower is going to harvest when the plant is ready, not in x number of days.

As I always veg for quite a while, I generally see plenty of pre-flowers before I flip. So does the appearance of flowers mean that I should start counting flowering when I see the preflowers? Nahh. I do like you do, I start counting the time the day I flip my lights, as flowering time is only a guideline anyway. When I get close to however many days the breeder says it takes, I start checking trichomes. Then, the plants are harvested when the trichomes says they are ready, regardless of how many days it is.

So, ultimately, I think that people should count the days however they feel most comfortable, cuz it doesn't really mean much anyway.
 
Some breeders use the timing from when you see flowering to begin, more because it makes their strains look like their flowering cycle is shorter than it really is, to sell beans. Flowering times should only be a guide. If growing out some F2 beans, you will see a wide variety of phenotype expression, including different flowering times. The range might be, 8 to 10 weeks with the majority within the 1st standard deviation of 64% in the middle of the range, and about 18% at either extreme. Within the range of pheno expression might include yield, THC levels, terpene development, height, spread, branching patterns, ect. However, the shortest and the longest flowering strains may not even have the attributes you are searching for. None of this is quantifiable per se, its more about reading the plant and not the breeder hype.
I find the same. Breeders want to advertise a quick turnaround. I get it. Quicker harvest equals more harvests.
 
Looks like you had great yield and frosty flowers on your grows so I think the visitors suggestion is a moot point. Most breeders seem to tout a 2 week span for flowering time so I view those numbers as a guideline. I think we all learn about a strain the first time we grow it and you folks with a lot of experience narrow the period down better based on past grows of similar strains. Personally I think people who want help or information ask for it. Unsolicited opinions are usually not appreciated by anyone. My opinion though is you should keep up the good work...
 
Actually, I have always thought that the breeders' flowering times were only estimates and are based on very well dialed in grow rooms...so counting the exact days doesn't really matter anyway. Any experienced grower is going to harvest when the plant is ready, not in x number of days.

As I always veg for quite a while, I generally see plenty of pre-flowers before I flip. So does the appearance of flowers mean that I should start counting flowering when I see the preflowers? Nahh. I do like you do, I start counting the time the day I flip my lights, as flowering time is only a guideline anyway. When I get close to however many days the breeder says it takes, I start checking trichomes. Then, the plants are harvested when the trichomes says they are ready, regardless of how many days it is.

So, ultimately, I think that people should count the days however they feel most comfortable, cuz it doesn't really mean much anyway.
It is just a guideline/guesstimate for me as well. Just wanted to clear up why i count the way i do.
 
Looks like you had great yield and frosty flowers on your grows so I think the visitors suggestion is a moot point. Most breeders seem to tout a 2 week span for flowering time so I view those numbers as a guideline. I think we all learn about a strain the first time we grow it and you folks with a lot of experience narrow the period down better based on past grows of similar strains. Personally I think people who want help or information ask for it. Unsolicited opinions are usually not appreciated by anyone. My opinion though is you should keep up the good work...
Back at you. Im open for suggestions as always. Unsolicited info is fine as long as we can leave out the condescension. Not that this time such was the case.
 
Lesso. I love your rationales listed above. I completely agree with objective vs subjective , and that you harvest ... when it's done to YOUR inspection criteria. You, the grower and consumer who might push one-way or another on the ripeness scale.

As far as I'm concerned, day one should be agreed upon as the Switch. Breeders who use anything else are being deceptive, and know full well that 90+% of us use the switch.
 
Breeders who use anything else are being deceptive, and know full well that 90+% of us use the switch.
I have always thought so. You see this a lot with autos. Breeders market autos to newbies with 50 day flowering times.... misleading the unaware newbie to think they will harvest a pound per plant in 50 days. Another thing i dont get is where they get their wild yield rates...450g/m2 etc.
 
I usually write a date of the switch on my cabinet door...for some reason, this time I decided to write down the date of the first confirmed pistal visibility....(yes subjective date)...It did seem to line up more closely with the breeders timeline but still not 100% accurate...flowers gonna be rip when they are but I’ll use the flip date and then watch for ripeness...
 
Those clones over in my thread are the 5th generation of that plant. I can't even meet my own numbers. Gen 3 took 59 days, gen 4 took nearly 70
 

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