What is wrong with my babies?!

[sneekatoke]

I have five growing right now in a hydroponics set up I made myself.

Using a 400w Mh for light
Advanced Nutrients SensiGrow A+B
My pH stays around 6-6.1 (controlled)
PPM floats around 300-400 atm
Temp is 73-77 during the day and 63-65 at night
Ventilation is good

Two of them are doing pretty well and then there are two that haven't grown since a little after I put them in the system and the leaves are sort of twisting but don't look burned or dying.. and then there's the one who keeps teasing me and acting like it's going to start looking better and actually is trying to grow.. I hope.... looking ok for now

I attached some pics to my intro post and now it won't let me post them here.

HERE is a link to the other thread.

The first 3 are of the ones not doing so well and the last one is of all of my babies. They're a little over 3 weeks from seed and the two sickly ones haven't grown up much the whole time but the roots look as healthy as the rest but maybe a little smaller .. a little but not much...

Any advice would be accepted gratefully!

 

[ShOrTbUs]

your ph is too high. you want to ph to 5.3, let it drift up to 5.8, then ph it back down. now, are these 3 weeks old from when u started germ or from when u saw first leaf growth.

if they're exactly 3 weeks old. they seem to be progressing just fine. as for the minor leaf discoloration, it might be from the ph being off. but we wont know till you dial in the hydro correctly first

edit: how close are you placing the MH light to the plants?

is this a dwc?, are you running at least 2 large air stones w/ a sufficient air pump?

 

[sneekatoke]

5.3-5.8? 5.8-6.2 you mean right? You want the pH higher with hydro I thought. I have been told this by many people and have read it in quite a few places as well. I was told that anything below 5.6 will result in lockout of certain nutes.
It is DWC and I do have air stones with adequate air pump. Light is about 14 inches from top of my plants and they are 3 weeks and 2 days old. If it is my pH then why are the others doing so well? I'm not saying your wrong, that's why I'm here, I don't know. This is my first hydro run.

 

[Budders Keeper]

Fem seeds of same strain I hope? The reason I ask is:

1) How are you going to remove the males plants when the roots are all intertwined with the females?

2) Different strains will have different nutrient requirements.

I think Shortbus hit it right on your ph. I run ebb&flo and I like to drift between 5.5 and 6.0. I've had strains that prefered the lower end as well as strains that prefered the higher end. Keeping it at 6.0-6.1 could very possibly lock out nutes.

http://www.marijuanapassion.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1908

^ This is a link to couple ph charts that show how different nutes are taken up best at different ph levels, and how the optimum ph for hydro and soil differ.

I wouldn't do anything drastic until they get a little bigger unless problems get worse. They may be having a rough start and grow out of it shortly.

Good luck and smoke up..... bk.

 

[sneekatoke]

They are all from the same strain but not feminized. Being that this is my first hydro run, I wanted to test the waters before I actually use the fem seeds I acquired. If I screw up then I will be out of a lil time and nutes but at least I will know I didn't really lose any money.

And if a male arrives I will remove it slowly and carefully? :stoned:

I should be able to tell before the roots start hugging. If not I will call a doctor in for surgery.

Thanks for tips so far guys!

I'll lower the pH a bit and keep updating.

Remember.. sharing is caring! Keep smokin!

 

[The Hemp Goddess]

5.3-5.8? 5.8-6.2 you mean right? You want the pH higher with hydro I thought. I have been told this by many people and have read it in quite a few places as well. I was told that anything below 5.6 will result in lockout of certain nutes.
It is DWC and I do have air stones with adequate air pump. Light is about 14 inches from top of my plants and they are 3 weeks and 2 days old. If it is my pH then why are the others doing so well? I'm not saying your wrong, that's why I'm here, I don't know. This is my first hydro run.

No, 5.3 to 5.8. Hydro takes a lower pH than soil. I do run mine up to 6.0 or so. I cannot imagine where you could have read that hydro takes a higher pH--it is pretty much common knowledge that hydro takes a lower pH and mistakes like that are generally fixed quickly in any reputable reference source. Here is a chart that shows the nutrient uptake at different pH levels.
http://www.marijuanapassion.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=1833&d=1141100090

Edit: Didn't see that Budders had already posted the link.

I would surmise that your other plants are doing okay because they do not require nutrients yet. Plants have enough stored energy to go 2-3 weeks without nutrients.

 

[sneekatoke]

:holysheep:
Well.. like I said, I was told and read otherwise. There's so much info on the net and it varies and apparently most of it is wrong. I'm used to growing in soil and outside. This is all sort of new to me. I'm open for any advice. As long as it is educated...

 

[The Hemp Goddess]

Can you point us to where you read this?

 

[Hushpuppy]

I just looked at your pics and they don't look all that bad to me. For 3 weeks from seed, they are a little behind the growth pattern for some strains, but growth patterns and plant needs and tollerances vary with different strains. I personally don't think PH is your issue. For hydro, 6.1 is a little high but I know others who never let their hydro systems get below 6.0 and they still do fine(as was said, different needs and tollerances). I would recommend trying to stay as close to 5.8 as possible and below 6.0 rather than above it.

That said, I suspect your problem is that you started the nutes too soon and stunted the growth by burning the roots just enough to slow everything down. When growing from seed, you don't want to give any nutes to the seedling until you see the little round first leaves start to yellow off. Those first leaves (called cotyledons) are the food leaves that the plant pulls from until its roots get developed enough to handle nutrients.

The length of time it takes for the cotyledons to yellow off varies with strains and environmental factors can affect that as well, but typically you don't want to give any nutrients until about the end of the second to third week, then start with the 200-300ppm.

At this point I would say to stay just like you are with the nutes at the low level and drop the PH a bit and give them some time to recoup, and they should pick up and go soon, then you can bump up the nutes a bit

 

[7greeneyes]

remember the Higher the Acidity the LOWER the ph number

 

[The Hemp Goddess]

I've got to say that I do not believe that your plants are showing any sign of nute burn. I'm more inclined to say the start of deficiencies.

I think that they are getting where they need food and I personally would advise getting the pH down. I know that I have problems if I let my pH stay in the 6.0 + range.

 

[pcduck]

I've got to say that I do not believe that your plants are showing any sign of nute burn. I'm more inclined to say the start of deficiencies.

I think that they are getting where they need food and I personally would advise getting the pH down. I know that I have problems if I let my pH stay in the 6.0 + range.

:yeahthat:

 

[sneekatoke]

I read some of it on the 420Magazine forums, THG, as well as some other random forums that I can't remember atm.. GrassCity I think was another.. I don't remember.. I smoke to much to often.. that might be part of the problem as well :stoned:

I also have this PDF from GreenCoast Hydro that's an AN hydro grow guide and schedule.

http://www.gchydro.com/pdf/advanced_schedule.pdf

It says 5.3-6.1 not 5.6-6.1.

I have to change out the nute tank tomorrow.. I think Im gonna run straight h2o for a day or two and then add my nutes then to let them wash their toes for a while.

I also read that putting a little h202(hydrogen peroxide) in the nute tank would help get oxygen to the roots as well as help keep away bacteria. Anyone have an opinion on this?

Thanks for the advice everyone!

 

[ShOrTbUs]

i run 2-3ml per liter of water of h202 every time i change my res. i would also advise taking what hush said to heart. wait till the cotyeldons begin to yellow before feeding again. even feeding them very little amounts will not speed up their growth. more then likely it will just burn your roots

 

[pcduck]

If you would look at the pH charts you would see that nitrogen at a pH of 5.3 is nearly out of range of being accessible and the P and MG it totally inaccessible.

I start my DWC at a pH of 5.5 and let it drift up to 6 with the uptake of nutes.

H2O2 will kill all the bad bacteria when present, if there nothing bad to kill it will start killing the good stuff. I use h2o2 only as a solution not as a preventative. If you keep your DWC nutes temp low enough 65-68 degrees, you do not need it.ime

 

[sneekatoke]

yeah I noticed that myself when I was studying the chart earlier pc..

so no h2o2 unless it is needed for algae, bad bacteria, etc. keeping the tank at a low temp (65-68) is a better preventive approach.. gotcha

Thanks!

 

[WeedHopper]

In Hydro,,lower solution temps like PCduck says,,, makes nice clean white roots. Higher temps are no good, especially in a DWC .
I love growing in Hydro,,but its a real pain in the *** to keep temps down here in the south. I used to keep frozen water bottles in my buckets to keep temps down. I ran my PH between 5.5 and 6.0 with no problems.

 

[The Hemp Goddess]

I hate to disagree with hush and shortbus, but I would be feeding these plants. Hydro are somewhat different than soil plants which pull nutrients from the medium. At 3 weeks, I would not wait for anything to yellow, I would feed. You will not burn the roots. Feed at low levels and work up slowly. And feeding them does make them grow, just as not feeding them stunts their growth. I always notice a burst of growth when the plants are moved from the cloner to a DWC and fed. I never use h2o2 unless I have a problem.

 

[Old Resin]

I don't use H202-I use hygrozyme-if you need to use H202-you need to flush-use Clearex. All H202 is-is hydrogen peroxide-poor some of that on your skin-then think about what it's doing to your roots. If you feel you must use H202-use at 1/4 strenth and aerate for 24 hours before hand. Aeration will put oxygen in the water. Water temps above 80 don't hold oxygen-thats why you need to keep the resevoir temp between 65-75 degrees. Do that and aerate-and you don't need H202. Hygrozyme is a natrual cleaner and is OMRI listed.

 

[WeedHopper]

Keep light out and temps down and you will not need those things.