Chemicle lockout?

[Hushpuppy]

I don't think the hygrozyme is the issue but with the dire situation that your plants are in at this point, the less ingredients in the mix the better for determining the focus of the problem. I also use the Hygrozyme and very much like the results, but I have also noticed that it will cause a significant drop in MY rez PH for which I have to adjust upwards to ballance it out.

I don't have to let my water sit as mine comes from a well that has a very low TDS (55ppm @6.8PH). Also my nutrients(advanced Nutrients' Jungle Juice) don't have any PH buffers other than the natural elements which will naturally affect the PH. When I mix mine, I have let it set to see if the PH changes and it doesn't change any after 10minutes from initial mixing.

That Small Boy filter is a good one, my brother has the same filter and it definitely reduces the TDS of his water. TDS is a measure of the Total Disolved Solids in the solution. Your water shouldn't have more than 100ppm to be ideal. More than 100ppm begins to be an issue, depending on what it is that is bringing the TDS above 100ppm. Many times a higher ppm is caused by disolved calcium, but if you are on city water, it could contain other chems from the water treatment such as chlorine or chloramine, which aren't good for plants in higher amounts. If your water comes from a well, it could have a lot of different elements disolved in it that could cause issues if not accounted for when setting up to use it.

Now your final TDS for your nute solution should be around 500-900ppm for adult plants in veg (some strains don't like a lot of nutes so they prefer the lower end of the spectrum, while other plants, typically Indica dominant, like heavier nutes and will be happier on the high end). The TDS for flowering should be about 1000 for the lower nute plants, up to 1500 or more for the high end nute eating Indicas. I grow typical hybrids that tend more to the Indica dominant so I usually run my nutes up to 800ppm for veg and 1200ppm for flower.

You said that your mix only raised .2 over night, that is good. Some people have a significant change with the GH nutes over time while I have heard others say that they don't have a big change. That is probably a difference in the source water. But until we can see the numbers with the meter we can't be sure.

 

[pcduck]

Have you done anything different this grow then the previous to cause the hygrozyme to be the problem?

Nearly all nutes have buffers especially the ones that are pH balanced. The manufactures add these buffers whether organic or synthetic in order to extend the shelf life. Otherwise the would only last from a few hours to a few day.

The small boy i believe is just a carbon filter system and not a R/O. The SB will remove the larger molecules but the smaller will pass through. Depending on what these smaller molecules are will determine if they act as a buffer.

City and well water I would bubble for 24 hours prior to adding nutes, 24 hours after adding nutes(to allow for the buffers to react to each other), then adjust the pH allowing ample time again for the buffers to react to each other.

R/O water allows me to skip the 24 hour adjustment periods as there are no buffers present in the R/O water that the nutes buffers need to react to. I use GH 3 part in my DWC grows and GH 3 has buffers in them that put the pH nearly spot on without the need adjust.(As many nute brands do if used according to the instructions.)

Make all adjustments prior to using on plants.
Always add the micro first to the water.

 

[pax125]

Got my meter and ph is 5.86. Close to my guesstimate. Tds I now know to be 2666. Any thoughts? They look about the same but it has only been two days.

 

[HighBrixMMJ]

That tds is too high IMO. I've never seen anything past 2200 being effective.

 

[pax125]

Ive looked around and found how to raise but how do I lower my Tds?!

 

[pcduck]

Ive looked around and found how to raise but how do I lower my Tds?!

Add less nutes

 

[Hushpuppy]

Oh wow that is too high and apparently causing toxicity and probably some chemical lockout. The only way to lower the TDS in your existing resevoir is to remove some of the solution, I would say half and then add back straight water as that will dilute the solution. If your solution is fresh and you don't want to waste what you remove, then hold on to it in a container and keep it aerated to prevent anaerobic microbes from getting into it, until you need it for topping up.

Then on the next water change, only use half of what you were using and check the TDS to see if you are down around 1200ppm. Have you checked the TDS of your source water to see what that is, it could still be a problem, or a contributing factor.

 

[The Hemp Goddess]

I wouldn't dump half and add water, as you really don't know what nutrients the plants have used and which may be at toxic levels. I recommend dumping the whole res and starting over. Start with a lower ppm than you started with before. If ppms rise, your nute solution is too strong. Make sure your meter is calibrated correctly.

 

[Hushpuppy]

That is a very good point. If you don't know what has been going on in the soup then its probably best to dump the whole thing and start over with the correct setup, and then go from there.

 

[pax125]

Well I'm a jackass! It was the first time using the meter if that's an excuse. I changed the water, again, cut the nutes in half again and my final read was 1970. I took a reading after adding each nute and wrote it down after every nute added. Then after all that I found that I was reading ec rather that Tds. Then I realized my mistake and a read the Tds and it was 984. So maybe I should add the amount of nutes back to where It was last step and read it from there. It seemed like the numbers are around half that of my previois readings. I don't suppose there is a conversion table for these two types of readings are there? My ph in the end was 6.3 and I dropped it to 5.8. This morning my ph was 5.98 and the Tds was 1011. My Tds out of the filter is 456. Can I store the meter with a little 4.0 in it to keep the electrodes good? How much do I put in there. I saw where it came with a small piece of sponge. Should I just keep it moist?

 

[Hushpuppy]

For now I wouldn't go back to the original amounts of nutes. I would wait until the water level goes down enough to need more, then mix up a fresh bucket of water and add in the nutes just a bit higher and see what levels you come to. Even ate 1000ppm, the level of nutes is fine for them, given what has happened. 1100-1200 is a good average max nute level for flowering so you would be just under that. And each time you top up, you can bump it a little until you get to about 1200.

Yeah the 4.0 calibration is a good fluid to use for storage according to what I have read on the manufacturer's site. I put a few drops in mine so that the bulb stays wet. I also have a glass cup that I fill with 40ml of fresh water and about 20ml of 4.0, and I set my probe in that when I am working rather than leaving it out or putting back in the cap every time.

Look on the manufacturer's website for a conversion table. There are 2 different conversions depending on the meter but the manufacturer should have that for yours

If your PH continues to move up each day, that is a good thing that means that the plants are eating. If it goes up to 6.2 within a couple days, when you adjust it back down, drop it to about 5.5, that will give you another day or two before having to adjust it again and it won't hurt the plants as different nute elements are absorbed better at different levels. This is what I call "the drift".

 

[pax125]

Awesome info! After all this I never did find the root of the problem. Im hoping that it was as originally though was a chemical lockout as i was keeping them constantly at the same ph level of 6.2 by testing every day. Maybe the plants are too far gone to actually be able to see any type of difference as all the leaves show so much damage. I shall see in a few days. Buds look good but may not get to their full size potential. Hopefully the potency will not be too limited as well. Thank you all so much!