Elephant Man's Grow Journal, 1st attempt

Still looking good eman, sorry about the few problems you had.

Thanks guys.:aok:

The mold thing was a simple mistake...completely rediculous and nearly impossible to have mold here in the desert, it was a simple curing blunder.

My buddy Fing helped me sort that one out...truth is, the bag and jar method of curing is just a fast way around the proper way. Hence DJ Short's title, 'the short cure method'. In reality, if you can, just leave it hanging for months in the proper environment. Tried it and I am much happier now.:smoke1:

Hemies: Well, to be honest with you, I am not afraid. One has to understand why it happens, it is an emergency system in place...and a very good one. In reality, we all have this 'genetic backup system' in place to thank for the fact MJ has survived our eradication attempts. The reason my JHxO hermed, is because it was a response given from equatorial sativas. In low latitude areas, the foliage holds the nutes, there is no topsoil...when the plant dies, it feeds it's offspring. By accidentally hitting one clone with a big dose of N late in flower, I caused her to attempt to revert....a tip to those growing strong sativa doms....better to starve them late in flower, it helps them finish.

Always more problems though, heat got a hold of my worms and they are not happy....I started a bigger bin on concrete and am hoping for the best, but I am short castings now and they are expensive.

I am going to post a kind of DIY for cloning phenos tonight...I think I need to. I also have a few entering 3 and 4 months cure I need to post strain reports for.

This Cherry Malawi was left in a 4 inch pot for fun, just to show peeps you do not need a special strain to grow little plants. Limit root zone and flower from seed. About halfway for this one.

Hmmmm, wonder how many of these will fit under 400.

Some of you long time 'living organic' followers may remember some posts early on in regards to my first organic mentor REv (rolanterroy). Unfortunately he is still MIA as far as I know, but thanks to the net, much of his work has been archived. IMO, it is invaluable reading for anyone having a tough time figuring this out. REv is a guru of organics and breeding, and a 'cite' in my book....in addition to an excellent tutor. Off topic but, an important thing to consider, is that wisdom and experience is not all that makes him a 'cite'. IMO, it is knowing the difference between opinion and fact...and REv is very clear in this regard in all his work...much respect...all the best wishes for him and his. :heart:

I wanted to post a soilmix for you guys, then I found REv's latest one I know of....so similar to mine, I wouldn't change a thing.:aok:

If you guys can't find something in particular, let me know...I can help you sub it out prolly'.

Enjoy

I have been using this with huge success with some local med peeps and so I thought I would share it. This mix is powerful, and you NEED to water it down well and let it "cook" for at least 7-10 days before using it or else some strains will trip a little. But as long as it sits for a bit and stays moist that whole time it's all good and powerful!

You pretty much only need good water with this one, and either spike in some bone meal into the flowering container transplant or just use a Fox Farms Big Bloom regiment which also works fine.

I recommend R/O water here (or distilled or rain water) but I have seen killer results with peeps using dechlorinated tap water as well, which is kindof amazing to me, but I loves it! Just use apple cider vinegar to bring it to about 6.5 pH and let it age for about 12 hrs bubbling and you're good to go mangs. OK here we go:

Let me say first theis is just what I do, take from it what you will or not, it's just for the hell of it and I wanna try and get more simple with everything too for you guys who like it that way; me, I'm a complicated f***er LoL!

Here we go really now...

The Following mix uses a 5 gallon bucket and an empty tote or something..

In a 5 gallon bucket combine:

1/3rd Good Organic Potting Soil - I recommend Fox Farms Ocean Forest

1/3rd Mushroom Compost or Top soil, no nutes really, and Chunky/woody.

1/3rd Vermiculite/Perlite mixed together 50/50

** for sprouts and freshly rooted clones, just the organic soil cut by 1/3rd with the vermiculite/perlite is bomber

**

POUR THESE INTO THE TOTE AND ADD THE FOLLOWING:

3 cups earthworm castings
This stuff brings so many good things to the table I can't list them all; this is an essential addition and makes for very happy boomin' plants!

1 cup Kelp meal
I use Down to Earth brand here, this has some N, and a good kicker of K (potassium) and covers a very broad band of trace elements; as well as some cool hormones etc. absolutely fantastic stuff!

1 cup crushed oyster shells
I love this stuff, and for soil structure purposes it rocks, but I have also noticed after harvesting when I take apart the rootballs slowly and examine the roots habits around varios additions, that there are always big soil aggrigates around the oyster shells. These are created by the exudes and polysaccarides of the microlife and so shows me they love these, I figure due to the local pH influences of the calcium carbonate which is what oyster shells are made of.

1/2 cup cottonseed or soybean meal
This is one of your prime long term slow release N sources and some killer organic matter as well. Into flowering cannabis really loves to be able to tap into some slow N like this and the diff between flower size in side by sides with and without this is noticable!

1 cup used coffee grounds
Great organic matter excellent slow release N source too, and I have a theory that pot likes caffine too LoL cuz man you can sure tell they like something extra special in coffee grounds yessir!

3 tablespoons Blood/Bone/Green blend
This is composed of 1 part Blood meal, 1 part steamed Bonemeal, and 2 parts Greensand. I prefer using Fishbone Meal here by Down to Earth brand, but I also love Fox Farms PoM steamed bonemeal as well.

4 tablespoons of prilled (pelletized or granulated) dolomite lime
My number 1 magnesium source right here along with excellent buffering in micro-environments within the soilmix. You can use about 1/3rd as much powdered lime here as well, but I prefer the granulated myself.

3 tablespoons Fox Farms PoM All Purpose 5-5-5
Great stuff, great microbeasties, and some kindof *magic* pH balancing lies within this stuff. A fantastic all purpose dry nutrient here IMO.

3 tablespoons Soft Rock Phosphate (micronized if possible)
This is myco-fungi's favorite source to bring P from to the roots from all I have read and it sure seems true as hell, try it you'll see your yields go way the hell up! Also a good source for sulphur and magnesium.

2 tablespoons High N Bat Guano
Really powerful N source here, fast burning at about 45 days total with good microlife boomin' and promotes good strong fast growth. I use Down to Earth brand here.

Mix all together fairly well, water good with 1 teaspoon per gallon of Blackstrap Molasses included and let cook foir about 7-10 days before use. Keep it almost over-moist for 7-10 days, not soggy but good and watered.

CONTAINER STUFF:

BOTTOM 1/5th of containers :

3 parts composted steer or chicken manure, 1 part crushed oyster shells. If you can't get oyster shells, use a little dolomite lime and some perlite/vermiculite for aeration purposes and buffering cuz the manure gets pretty hot heh heh.

TOP 1/5th of containers :

1 part Basic mix above (base mix) and 1 part Earthworm castings, with an additional 1 teaspoon per gallon of container size of: Bird Guano, Prilled Dolomite, and PoM 5-5-5



OK there ya have it, hopefully some of you will find this helpfull to you; there are many ways to grow great herbs and this is one of them.

Additionally here I wanna add that you should use some myco-fungi from day 1 and I use poth the granulated during transplants and the water soluable here and there as well mixed with water and applied that way. Good established myco-fungi is one of the big keys here to a great and bountyful yield! My yields were one thing that bothered me early on when growing 100% organics, and those days are long gone hahaha, I yield BIG and KILLER buds consistantly with all strains I have grown this way to date.

Although my personal mix is more complex that this one (Duh, I'm a dork that way) and I use things like Humes and Soilbuilder, Yucca extract, yada yada, this mix has proven to kick major organic *** several times already under fairly different environmental situations. On one occasion, since we couldn't get the growroom temps down below 80DEG F. we had to cut the base mix by about 1/4th with additional Mushrrom Compost cuz it was just metabolizing too fast and getting too powerful too fast. So this is always an option should your needs be likewise for that or other reasons.

I also like to use Blackstrap Molasses (unsulphured) about every 3rd watering at a rate of 1 teaspoon per gallon; using it everytime keeps a larger amount of nutrients immobilized within the massive PoPulations of microlife themselves, so you want the rythm goin' on so they boom then die back releasing all the goodies they be a holdin'

I now also heat my water (fishy aquarium heater) to 70 deg F. and aerate it always with a little air pump and stone. The baybees love it, my temps can get a little bit low in my nighttime hours in the winter especially and I find this works GREAT to get them up and diggin' on stuff faster and metabolizing things faster as well. So my winter growth rates are up there with my summertime rates since this adidition.

OK good peeps, hope you guys dig this! One post rather than 37 pages heh heh, gettin' simpler fellas hahahaha!

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Man...After seeing yours and HGB's 4" pot grows and solo cup grows...I'm almost thinking of just growing as many as I can get to fit in a 6 square foot space under a 600w. Is there any deminished quality in the bud from growing like this? I'm caught between growing 6 plants in 3 gallon buckets and growing a lot more in these small pots. What do you think?

LaserKittensGoPewPew said:

Man...After seeing yours and HGB's 4" pot grows and solo cup grows...I'm almost thinking of just growing as many as I can get to fit in a 6 square foot space under a 600w. Is there any deminished quality in the bud from growing like this? I'm caught between growing 6 plants in 3 gallon buckets and growing a lot more in these small pots. What do you think?

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If this is your first time growing, I would stick with stable hybrids, 2-3 gallon pots, vegging to preflowers....etc.

As far as maturity having anything with potency, I personally don't think so, but this is debateable. IMO, nearly impossible to prove or disprove...too many variables involved between genetics and environment.

One thing is obvious though, some of the most powerful herbs on the planet come from very close to the equator, where there is never more than 13 hours of light a day. Time to maturity from birth has alot to do with a 12/12 regime from birth...some plants will be very small, some can hit 6-7 feet...with no veg light cycle, but as I understand it, potency is not affected either way.

More commentary br REv on the mix above:

Thanks guys heh heh, and remember that this is a base-mix, it's complete with everything cannaplants need pretty much heh heh. So if it is a little too hot by itself for some genetics just cut it with some topsoil or vermiculite or whatever. All the stuff I have seen in this mix (straight up no cut) kicks major *** heh heh. Plus there's plenty of room for modifications too.

One thing I wanna stress (again LoL) to you guys is the importance of watering twice (or slowly like a drip or whatever) to make sure the whole container-mix gets watered when ya do water. This has major effects on things like Ca and Mg too, cuz the roots will quickly start "guiding" waterflow within the mix and they tend to cause dry-spots which can cause several little prollems, mostly as I have seen with Ca and Mg; so don't forget mangs, it's a GREAT growing habit to get into!

** RECENTLY **

I have started cutting my R/O water with ever-so small percentages of Tap water; now, the reasons I do this is due to the fact that cannabis (and most plants too) use some seriously exotic trace elements in super-small nano-amounts, stuff like Cobalt, Aluminum, even Chlorine

and so Tap water being a PRIMO source for all these (except I bubble out the Chlorine) I use it at a rate of: 3 parts r/o water to 1 part Tap water about every 3rd watering or so. This has worked out fine and dandy for many med-peeps I have on this plan heh heh. But that's just like my own little tweak and they grow just fine and dandy using R/O water or Distilled water as well.

I am currently running a few at a friends house using straight up (de-chlorinated) tap water, my theory is that my exotic Biozome micro-beasties can make this OK, we shall see!

BIOZOME LINKER : BIOZOME

Rock On good peeps!

- REvonator

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Marine Cuisine, American Pride Etc...

When using (great) nutes like these that have many uses, the "type" I am referring to is combined fast and long term release dry nutes like the above and others. You can add these right on the floor of your containers, no soilmix between it and the bottom of the containers and they work fantastic like this. This allows the bigger roots exploring the container bottoms to find and use these very easily when placed as I say above.

Sometimes if I am growing a super exotic strain, like a land race or something, I will aften times use about 1/2 teaspoon of Marine Cuisine on the floor of a 5" container and keep the soilmix itself on the weak side. This always has worked out fantastic for me and others that have used it as well.
When growing longer flowering strains this is also a handy fast addition into the flowering container transplant; just keep in mind these nutes above and many like it will release good amounts of nutes for 60+ days... So just keep that all in your head as far as flowering times go.

- REv

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Oh heh heh, one more important thing I think I should clear up regarding this dynamic mix.....

DOn't place your rootball during a transplant, directly on the bottom (1/5th) layer of composted **** x oyster shells/whatever... Always have at least a few inches of base mix between it and the rootball

IME. Also regarding the bottom layer:

I find it advantageous to "scoot" this layer out around the bottom rim of the container so that it is a big ring at the floor of the container rather than just a normal layer. This works really well I'm pretty sure because the biggest hunter/water roots love to go arond the bottoms of your containers, and so it simply makes it all that much more simple for them to just "swim" in all that powerful **** and absorb mucho nutrients and elements from it.

This mix is also absolutely killer to recycle. As you recycle it, keep in mind that some of your elements, like the bonemeal, rock phosphate, greensand etc, will still be chuggin' along pretty good so less additions are good as you progress. Also, your Vermiculite/Perlite and Oyster Shells additions will fall back as you recycle your *** off, cuz they recycle right along with everything else heh heh.

- REvonator

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Sorry guys, several posts tonight...trying to catch you guys up on some stuff.

This one is just some harvest pics. Strain is 'NL#5 X Afghani'. She was vegged till preflowers at about 3 weeks (I see them VERY early ) and sent in to flower...went 8-9 weeks, I don't keep track...only from pheno to pheno. This grow of this strain was only a test, and not about optomization. I fed her lightly, observed, and took notes. She was pollenated, and after a 3 month cure I will decide whether or not to keep her. 2 other phenos were seeded also and taken last week, but this one 'appears' to be the alpha pheno...only time will tell. So far her aroma is very nice...on the fruity side...very sticky girl too, and pistils lean towards an orange color. Very hybrid like bud structure, lankiness of a sativa, but full of bracts and leaf trichs like an indy. IMO, phenos were close enough to have been F1's, but too soon to tell. We will see what happens next go around, if I like her smoke.

It appears Blue Mystic (blueberry X SK1) may be on the way out.:bump: Looks like my 'narcotic bedtime smoke' is being replaced.

Something very special happened....here is the story:

Of my White Widow run, I saw 10 of 10 phenos. I pollenated all fems with my favorite male, and decided to take notes. At the time I did not know why I was doing what I did, but I do now...and I am incredibly thankful.

You cloners out there...listen carefully...

During WW's entire time in flower, I was particularly excited about one extremely vigorous pheno. Yeilded 25% more (or so) over all the others, had a beautiful 'yellow' tint, and smelled of wonderful earthy spice. I was very excited to sample this girl, and after a short one month cure, I did.

Not all that impressed. As always, taken just abit early on my first run...more about making seed...but I can base alot on that...having messed with smoking everything I grow (early, males, late, before and after cure). I still have to do a few more 'sober morning wake and tests' with her, and revisit her after 2 more months cure, but you get the idea. Much more experimenting necessary to test her tolerance effects and ceiling.

So....anyway...I was pretty discouraged but a week later, I thought to sample one of the other phenos. Wow...:stoned: broke up a small joint, saving my seeds made, and stained my fingers orange. Very 'fuel' like smell too. I actually had to scrub my fingers clean just to finish rolling the joint...should have seen how excited I was to light it.

Ok....this really means nothing to me YET, but this was the most powerful joint I have smoked yet. Even surpassing a freind's, a 50/50 iso-hash joint, etc. I have smoked 2 and 1/2 joints playing with JHxO ceiling (or lack of ) and been way more wasted, but for only being able to finish half of a joint of this, I was very impressed.

More tested is needed with her tolerance and ceiling though...in all honesty, she could still be no better than 'street weed'. Depends on what is important to you.

Fellow poster and sativa lover 'Motaco' said it best:

Reminds me of what an old dealer I used to have would tell people. It was during that era that "indo" was starting to actually hit the street market. Just powerful sleepy BC indica in those days. back when kindbud lbs were red not green lol.

He didn't like this new bud, or the market. He said people were trying to turn weed into drugs and he didn't like it, didn't think it was good for people cuz it didn't get them high it got them loaded and sleepy, and he wasn't going to sell it. He was very oldschool. Never owned a pipe; he rolled everything he smoked. Rare to find he had quality control on his schwag. he wouldn't buy nasty lbs. only the good ones. Good schwag and midgrade was all he ever sold.

When people would come around and ask for "endo" he'd tell them: "Two blocks down and make a right, they got black tar heroin $10 dollar holla's. Your gonna have to go catch your NODS with them fools because we're getting HIGH on this corner"

and I know where he's coming from. we got weed that gets you HIGH and we got weed that gets you LOW. if your looking to get LOW you better stop and think on it for a while. are you actually trying to catch a weed buzz or maybe just substituting it for something else?

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Anyway, you cloners, unless you are growing specifically for yeild (whether it is rope or drugs:huh: ) you are much better off keeping clones of all your phenos till after long cure and much testing. I actually have discovered I will need a few samplers with more discerning pallats than myself very soon....any volunteers?...just kidding :rant:

Haha... Oh Eman. That's a very good point and one I actually follow. I learned that the hard way by loosing out on my only killer Twilight pheno.

And Rev's 07 soil mix... Between that and what I've seen you make, I made myself my simpler soil mix which is working out fantastic so far. Thanks for sharing the knowledge!

hi there E-Man all this info is absolutly priceless to me, thanks man. on my next grow i'm gonna try the above mix. i'll have to go hunting all the ingredients. cheers bud!!

Eman the mad scientist. You are truly a modern day Dr Frankenstein. Do ya thing homie! :farm:

:banana: You guys are the reason I post. I dream of the day we can all sit and enjoy our organic goodness together, legally. This fat doobie and many others are here waiting for that day.:tokie:

DL and NGT my 'beastie farming' bros, let me know if there is anything I can do for you...don't be shy...post up right here if you like...I haven't been making my rounds as much as I would like. ...too busy reading.

Herbibrother: Are you in the USA my freind? East or west coast? I can help you find stuff, don't be afraid to ask.

Right now, believe it or not, I am stuck on males. More research has led me to believe that the key in my seed lies within the male...after all, fems are easy to choose.:ccc: I have full flowered perhaps 50 males now...about 10 strains, and one 'stud' has stood out. I thought that was enough, but it appears I will have to use the 'progeny' method.

I know this sounds like mumbo jumbo to you guys, I promise I will explain soon. I really don't see a point in hiding my methods from you...and no, I will never make you buy a book.

I wanna say something here about 'semi-organics'. As REv has stated, if you are running Biozome or Subculture or any other super-exotic beasties, I believe they can take a little more abuse...they are gathered from the harshest climates on earth. BUT...before I add ANYTHING to my soil I want to know what is in it. Guys like REv I trust (I hear you too KADE ) use things like 'Superthrive'. Believe me my fellow farmers, I looked into the stuff. The only 'secret' ingrediant I discovered in it is Triacontinol, which is in the alfalfa meal and alfalfa pellets I use (rabbit food). Unless someone can tell me exactly what is in a product, I don't add it...simple as that. By the way, if you use 'Stuporthrive', please, do not add it in flower.

Just a couple of pics of more 'wackiness'. We call this a 'soilbed'. For me it is my indoor garden:farm: :heart: ....plant a seed, harvest a plant...I am going to love it.

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Hey Eman I have a question. I gave my plants a drink with 1 tbsp of molassess/per gallon of water and now the smell pissy. Like a cat pissed in the pots. Is this a natural reaction and do it being a beastie grow? If not what are the remedies? Thanks in advance.

hi E-Man, i live in england, but i do all my shopping online, i'm finding it difficult to find the things i need, i found things like black strap molasses and crushed oyster shells on e-bay, iv'e got plenty of time to gather everything together for my next grow. iv'e still got a few weeks left on my current plants. if you got any good orgaic suppliers online i'd appreciate it. thanks

NGT: One tablespoon is abit heavy on the molasses, I usually never go over one teaspoon. I have to add it nearly every feeding once flower starts (possibly low RH), but a big thing to remember is we don't want our beasties too have it to easy ...there is plenty of food in our soil for them to work on...without handfeeding them candy. I hear alot of growers talking about causing your beasties to 'boom and recede' with infrequent feedings and lots of the purest water possible the rest of the time, this seems to provide the best results.

Hebijesus: Oh right...UK...I forgot....did I give you that Plagron soilmix? As you know, I am a firm believer in Biobizz products too...especially for those in UK that can get them cheaper than I can.

Ebay is a great place too, as is any nursery or even feed store (livestock)...you would be surprised how much of this stuff those places will have.

I don't have any links to specific UK shops though, sorry, but I have seen them....I will look around and try to get a pm out to you soon.

Thanks E! I was told that 2 tbps of h2o2 added to a gallon of water will help kill the anerobic beasties and leave oxygen for the aerobic ones. If this is true can I use this to remedy it.

newgreenthumb said:

Thanks E! I was told that 2 tbps of h2o2 added to a gallon of water will help kill the anerobic beasties and leave oxygen for the aerobic ones. If this is true can I use this to remedy it.

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I tell ya man...the only 2 things I fear really are H2O2 and salts. Anareobic beasties are not bad, but I have seen from composting, they come from overwatering and compaction. You can tell if you get them, from old tea and from not turning compost often enough...actually, I don't toss them, old tea or soil...just let it dry thoroughly and they will recede...add old tea to old soil or compost and let it dry out. I have a hard time seeing any ferts go to waste.

I have to say something about my experience with soilbeds so far...this is not directed at you NGT, or anyone in particular....but

2 things to remember:

1) As just about everything in this thread lately, this is an advanced method. Sorry to keep repeating that, but the truth is, it is very difficult to bring young ones up in large amonts of soil...overwatering in big containers, or uncertainty with feedings can be disasterous. I am feeding and water 1/3 as much and much less often...very little room for error...every feeding counts.

2) Please notice in the diagram how Soma calls this an 'organic soilbed'. In my opinion, it would be VERY difficult to do this with synthetic ferts. As you can see, there is no drain...so there is no flushing. I think it could be done, but you better really know your ferts and plants.

One more random tip...I see alot of new growers making a very simple mistake...plants are different from humans...they get energy from light...not food. Feeding your soil and keeping it rich is providing the environment for the most light usage...adding more food will not increase this...find a happy medium/schedule and stick to it, your plants will do the rest. Small changes are much better, don't fight with the fact that your plant is trying to adapt to you, you will both be going opposite directions.

Thanks E!

i think it was shuggy who you gave the plagron too, but i did see that.
iv'e been looking at the bio-bizz all mix, but if i go with that, i'm not sure if i should be adding things to it.
it says that the all mix contains a blend of baltic peat moss, compost,worm castings, perlite and a special pre-mix.
if i go with that should i still be adding things like crushed oyster shells and dolmite lime or anything else?