Plant maturation & flushing

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Alistair

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Hello,

My name is Alistair and I've a question regarding how to flush plants in regards to how plants mature. In general a plant doesn't mature all at once. Often times a plant matures from the top down. So, when you harvest you pick the buds from the top down as they mature; you don't harvest the whole plant all at once if you want all your buds to be mature. However, when flushing this might prevent a problem, because you might want to flush, harvest the tops buds and then start fertilizer regime again, flush and then pick some more buds, etc. This seems like one way of flushing. Is there anybody who has any suggestions on how to flush. I almost forgot, I'm talking about soil farming, not hydro.

Thanks,

Alistair
 
Once you have buds that are ripe enough to harvest you can continue to flush...maybe not as aggressively.

I would recommend using brown sugar 1/2 tbsp per gal to give the plants something to eat while you are harvesting. If you hit them with ferts...even a small amount it's gonna go straight to the buds and stay there. Ready for your enjoyment when it's time to smoke.

The buds at the bottom should be ready much sooner than the plant needs to be fed again. Plus she has probrably built up "Saddle Bags" of nutes in the leaves and stems. It usually takes about 21 days for her to consume all of them. Flushing just removes them from the soil so she can't absorb them anymore

At least that's what happened to me...

-FNG
 
Thanks FNG,

I know very little about flushing. All I've done in the past regarding flushing is to stop fertilizing and simply water with plain RO water about 1-2 weeks before harvest. Normally this has worked out fairly well, but I don't seem to quite get all the nutrients flushed out, seeing as they seem to taste a bit like chemicals. So, with that in mind, the last time I flushed way too early and ended up with buds with no buzz, a big buzz kill.
I've read that flushing should be started when the buds have about 50% red or brown hairs, and then harvest when about 75% of the hairs are red or brown. I need to figure out how to flush out the nutes, but not too soon.
The problem with waiting until 50% of the hairs have turned to red is that it's usually less than 2 weeks (often times less than a week) before the buds are mature. A lot of people recommend 2 weeks of flushing, and some recommend starting the flush about 1 - 1 1/2 weeks before the anticipated harvest.
Another problem is that the plant strains are not known, so knowing how long their flowering cycle will be is a bit of a guessing game.
Ok, here's the ultimate question: What are some good ways to flush? Don't forget, we're talking about soil farming here.

Thanks,

Alistair
 
PS. I forgot to say that when flushing all I do is water as usual, except no more fertilizer is added. I don't give them tons of water or anything like that. I simply water and wait until the soil is near dry and then water again. Sometimes that means that they only get one watering without nutes before harvesting, because by the time the soil is dry and they are ready for watering again the buds are mature. Obviously I'm not understanding the process.

Thanks again,

Alistair
 
The "Hairs" you're referring to are called "Pistils" and have absolutely nothing to do with the timing of a harvest.

There are a dozen reasons that pistils turn colors, and none of them have anything to do with the plants readiness for harvest.

You need to go to radio shack and buy a 30-100 Microscope for 10 bucks and look at your "Trichomes".

The Trichomes are the only way to tell if your plants are ready.

http://www.marijuanapassion.com/forum/showpost.php?p=215327&postcount=5

I would suggest that you do a lot of reading in the harvesting/curing area. You'll learn a lot.

My personal belief is that flushing your plants is a total waste of time. I believe it to be a popular rumor based in no facts what-so-ever.

If anyone has any scientific studies that have been performed on it, I'd love to read them.

There is no "Flushing" procedure that I've heard of in any studies for any plants. If it were a true method, at least one of the groups who study Marijuana Botany for medical research would have performed the test and posted results in one of the Journals. They haven't. That alone tells you something.

The "Flushing" process is scientifically unsound. The reasons it's done defy any real processes in the plant. Plants just don't work that way.

However, it's a very, very popular rumor. Sooner or later, someone will do a professional study on it and disprove it once and for all.

I wish they would hurry up and do it. Frankly, I'm so tired of hearing about this fantasy that I'd pay them to do it now.

Good luck to you, and read up on the incredibly fascinating plant that you're growing and enjoy your harvest.

Look for any threads about "Trichomes", (Trikes, Trichs, resin glands).
 
I too believe flushing is a myth, all I know for sure is I have some non flushed white widow, hydro grown, chem ferts and its some of the best tasting weed I or anyone I know has smoked.

People just hit the bowl and say- toke "damm thats good"...................... toke -"damm thats good"
 
well , i didnt expect you to say that GD.


i really dont want to even get into it. but i have to politely disagree.


but i will say this. just because a study hasnt been made ....doesnt mean something isnt true. i can say from personal expierence is even better than a "clinical study" because i have it in front of me, not in writing. so i will say that i flush and it makes my weed smoke and taste smoother than anything i can buy.


opinions are like buttholes, we all have one! and thats all i have to say.
 
Potus is right, and this comes up here every couple of months and has been now for a while, still no one and IMEAN NO ONE has been able to prove this in any way yet for as long as curing weed has been perfected...

you also have to take in consideration of what the plants do with the ferts, once the plant absorbs the nutes it is blended with other chemicals found within the plant while it is broken down to different proteins needed, so through this processs you this nutes are really turned into other forms of liquids that should be the same taste IMHO...:aok:
 
trillions of atoms said:
just because a study hasnt been made ....doesnt mean something isnt true.
I respect your opinion but on that same note, plenty of test have been done by experienced growers with 20+ years experience and none have been conclusive to state that flushing makes a difference. If you dont believe me just ask here, we have a couple of those growers around here.

trillions of atoms said:
i can say from personal expierence is even better than a "clinical study" because i have it in front of me
I dont know how much scientific knowledge do you have on the subject but the variations of things that can cause a different taste are so many that it would take a person with a lot of scientific knowledge on how the plant works on all levels and i would say some good scientific testing equipment on top of that. Also it doesnt hurt to listen to an old man thas been smoking and growing weed longer than i have been alive. :aok:
 
you can say that they have growing expierence for over twenty yrs...but thats when they were using mercury vapor and growing hermis thinking the bud they were getting and finishing was the best. but where has the quality of green been in recent years?

up up up and away! if you wanted to look at thc, yeild and quality of the MJ here and then... i think youd laugh with me trying to do the math from here to there. the technology and the knowledge we have today was nothing near what it was in the mid fiftys and sixties.

so im still waiting on your proof aswell....

enguard! :cool:
 
Hey man i wasnt starting a debate since i am probably one of the last persons qualified, i was just passing on information that by my opinion has held a higher ground on the truth scale from all the info gathered from this forum. I myself just started growing a year ago and still learn something new everytime i log, so i am as open minded as a curious baby but truth has to be proven not believed in my book but once again that is my opinion from Knowledge gathered here.

At the same time i didnt get what you meant as far as the technology, do you mean to say that just because they didnt have the same technology then what they learned is useless?
To me 20+ years experience means understanding how the plant works and reacts at the same time understanding the technology better than any of us since they have gown with the technology and have figured out by trial and error what works out best. Do yoiu think people that have been growing for 20+ years still use the same oild technology? they adapt to what the best product they can afford and know what works to get to their results even thou is not always the latest on the tech scale. but now i say to you what proof backs your theory? and by proving your theory i mean you said you were the one with the proof in front of you?
 
the proof is in the pudding, you just have to see it and understand it is all. the only way you could know is to try like you said trial and error and use your best judgement. i know that flushing cuts down on my cure time. i know i get smoother tasting buds in less time in bags and jars than i do if i havent flushed them.

thats what ive come to understand from my results from my expierence.

i am not saying yer right or im right.

im saying i flush and i stand by the results. you can all do what you wanna do :) its one half dozen a 6 count the next or 6, one half dozen the other :p
 
you can do something the same way for 20 plus yrs....but that doesnt make it the right way ;)
 
trillions of atoms said:
you can do something the same way for 20 plus yrs....but that doesn't make it the right way ;)

Of course it does if it's been proven to be correct and nothing has altered that correctness.

Proof in the science world is called "Scientific Method". <===read this.

Unless you have performed a side by side laboratory quality test that proves what you say, then it's just anecdotal evidence. That type of evidence is meaningless, because you can't prove it wouldn't have happened with that grow without the flush.

You may argue all you want, but that's the difference between a scientist and someone who is not a scientist. Scientists prove their theories so that there is no "if" in the process.

Of all the THOUSANDS of scientists that are currently studying Marijuana for medical use, not one has ever performed a test on "flushing" in regards to improving taste or thc content. There is ample anecdotal evidence to inspire them to do so, but still they haven't bothered to do the testing.

I think the reason for that is that "flushing" defies the actual processes of the plant. The fact that it simply CAN'T be true prevents it from ever being tested.

It's like someone saying that a human can turn into a butterfly. They can say that they have SEEN it a hundred times. No one will ever perform a test to prove it, because the very process is impossible. It's the same with "flushing" to improve taste or thc content.

Sorry man. You have no proof to offer other than more anecdotal evidence.

Here we go again...
 
Firepower said:
I respect your opinion but on that same note, plenty of test have been done by experienced growers with 20+ years experience and none have been conclusive to state that flushing makes a difference. If you dont believe me just ask here, we have a couple of those growers around here.


I dont know how much scientific knowledge do you have on the subject but the variations of things that can cause a different taste are so many that it would take a person with a lot of scientific knowledge on how the plant works on all levels and i would say some good scientific testing equipment on top of that. Also it doesnt hurt to listen to an old man thas been smoking and growing weed longer than i have been alive. :aok:

in all honesty y'all are all arguing over an opinion. it may be harsh for one person but not for the other or vise a verse. the only thing that can be proven scientifically is how much of the chemicals are left after flushing. that's it. taste, harshness is all a matter of opinion.
 
LowRider said:
in all honesty y'all are all arguing over an opinion. it may be harsh for one person but not for the other or vise a verse. the only thing that can be proven scientifically is how much of the chemicals are left after flushing. that's it. taste, harshness is all a matter of opinion.

Two points I have to make. One is that we aren't arguing. We're discussing a theory.

Secondly, a double blind taste test is how this type of issue is settled. Food companies do it all the time.
****
control group study

A control group study uses a control group to compare to an experimental group in a test of a causal hypothesis. The control and experimental groups must be identical in all relevant ways except for the introduction of a suspected causal agent into the experimental group. If the suspected causal agent is actually a causal factor of some event, then logic dictates that that event should manifest itself more significantly in the experimental than in the control group.

For example, if 'C' causes 'E', when we introduce 'C' into the experimental group but not into the control group, we should find 'E' occurring in the experimental group at a significantly greater rate than in the control group. Significance is measured by relation to chance: if an event is not likely due to chance, then its occurrence is significant.

A double-blind test is a control group test where neither the evaluator nor the subject knows which items are controls.

The purpose of controls and double-blind testing is to reduce error, self-deception and bias.

A taste test is a tool used to gather information about the flavor of a food or product. It may be used by a company to ensure consistency, a manufacturer developing a new product, or a group which is trying to prove a point about the differences, or lack thereof, between two products. There are an assortment of other uses for a taste test, which is often carried out on the corporate level by professional &#8220;tasters&#8221; who have trained to be impartial and valuable tools in the taste profiling process.

When a taste test is used to compare or contrast foods, it is typically performed blind. In a blind taste test, the tasters do not know what they are tasting. They are offered samples of the product in identical presentations and asked to taste and profile the samples. In a double-blind taste test, the people offering the samples also do not know what they are. This is designed to ensure impartiality, making the end results potentially more valid.

Any sort of edible can be analyzed using a taste test. Some famous taste tests include the regular quality control taste tests performed by a number of companies which want to keep their products consistent and taste tests comparing well known brands of soda. Taste tests have also been performed on everything from water to salt. Often, a taste test illuminates very subtle and complex differences between product formulations, especially when professional tasters are involved.

To run a professional taste test, each taster is typically isolated in a booth. The tasters usually wear no perfumes or scents, and their clothing is laundered in neutral soaps. This is intended to minimize interference with the taste test. Usually a palate cleanser is provided as well, so that each taster can start fresh with each taste. An array of numbered samples are provided, and the taster checks each one, taking notes or making comments about the product.

When a company is gearing up for a major product release, taste tests are very important. A panel of tasters will ultimately determine the formulation of the product, by commenting on flavors and textures they like and do not like. For companies which want to keep their products consistent, a panel of trained tasters familiar with their products is crucial.

People can replicate a taste test at home for fun if they would like to do things like contrast bottled and tap water or experiment with a panel of wines. When conducting a taste test at home, try to avoid biasing the participants. A blind taste test is a great way to do that, and can be accomplished by having an &#8220;administrator&#8221; fill sample cups out of sight of the participants.
 
The Effen Gee said:
Once you have buds that are ripe enough to harvest you can continue to flush...maybe not as aggressively.

I would recommend using brown sugar 1/2 tbsp per gal to give the plants something to eat while you are harvesting. If you hit them with ferts...even a small amount it's gonna go straight to the buds and stay there. Ready for your enjoyment when it's time to smoke.

The buds at the bottom should be ready much sooner than the plant needs to be fed again. Plus she has probrably built up "Saddle Bags" of nutes in the leaves and stems. It usually takes about 21 days for her to consume all of them. Flushing just removes them from the soil so she can't absorb them anymore

At least that's what happened to me...

-FNG


So are you sayin you shouldnt be giving ur plants nutes during flower at all?
 
in all honesty y'all are all arguing over an opinion. it may be harsh for one person but not for the other or vise a verse. the only thing that can be proven scientifically is how much of the chemicals are left after flushing. that's it. taste, harshness is all a matter of opinion.



thats a fine piece of info right there.




and whats so funny is..... potus, you stand by clinical studies rendering scientific information, even giving links to clinical studies...yet there is no clinical studies that show proven scientific facts of your original hypothesis.

thats where your post to shoot me down comes down headfast.;)

we are talking over opinion....

like LR said, were are arguing an opinion..... thank you lowrider for understanding our instance.
 
trillions of atoms said:
in all honesty y'all are all arguing over an opinion. it may be harsh for one person but not for the other or vise a verse. the only thing that can be proven scientifically is how much of the chemicals are left after flushing. that's it. taste, harshness is all a matter of opinion.



thats a fine piece of info right there.




and whats so funny is..... potus, you stand by clinical studies rendering scientific information, even giving links to clinical studies...yet there is no clinical studies that show proven scientific facts of your original hypothesis.

thats where your post to shoot me down comes down headfast.;)

we are talking over opinion....

like LR said, were are arguing an opinion..... thank you lowrider for understanding our instance.


Tho when flushing it does it flush what is actually already in the buds or what...
(u use nutes during flowering right?) if so given an 8 week flowering period when would u stop feeding nutes ( and start flushing)
 
trillions of atoms said:
yet there is no clinical studies that show proven scientific facts of your original hypothesis.

Sure there is man. It's called "Botany 101" and it's been shown as proven facts for more than 3 decades of modern chemistry and botanical sciences added to many hundreds of years of study and research of people throughout history.

Available at almost any college.

Once you're aware of how a MJ plants metabolism really works, it becomes obvious why flushing the plant would do more harm than good. I'm very serious. In the very first year of botany you learn why this myth of "flushing" couldn't work on a marijuana plant for improving anything.

I'm not trying to "shoot you down" man. I'm just presenting a scientific point of view.

"Flushing" in all of it's various incarnations is already proven false in the absence of scientific testing. Of course the various countries scientists have heard about the "flushing" technique and it's proposed benefits. They'd have to be blind and deaf not to have heard about it when they're in that very field of study.

If you present "flushing" to any second year Botany student or above, they'll tell you that it just can't happen.

The theory of how it works is seriously flawed. There is no method of flushing that would do anything but harm an MJ plant with the exception of flushing the plant in the event of over fertilization. The toxic amounts of soil held salts can be reduced greatly by flushing them from the soil. That, of course, isn't the same type of flushing we're talking about.

Anecdotal evidence aside, there really is only one side to this debate. Flushing is a widely propagated, immensely wished for myth of many versions.

What I'm attempting to do is educate everyone here so as to avoid time lost and potency lost as a result of this "flushing" myth. I've studied this plant for quite some time. It's a fascinating plant. It's all good.

However, if it really, really makes you feel better to do it and you feel it makes your pot better, then who in the world am I to try to tell you different?

Have fun man. Get high and enjoy.

Peace!
 

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