First grow questions -

OldHippieChick

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I'm getting ready for my first indoor grow - I'm going organic and chose soil over hydro. I had to keep it simple - I am NOT a "mad scientist" type girl.

I've made some decisions and still up in the air about some other points.
The closet is 5'x7' and I got a 1000w HPS..... I'm considering knocking off 2' with a black out curtain to make it a 5x5 square.
I started 3 ice and 5 WW seeds in a jiffy growhouse... have 5 crystal seeds soaking - I'm just to blind and to nervous about the paper towel method after none of my bag seeds sprouted so am happy with the JG method this time round. The first lil WW sprouted today - I'm so damn proud :).

I picked up ten 3 gallon pots at the HD and a ph tester this weekend. I know many here say I need to put them in smaller pots first but do I have to ?

After first thinking I'd go with FFOF I've tentatively decided on a ProMix blend. Here's what the web site says about it....

PREMIER GROWER MIXES PRO MIX HP
PRO-MIX 'HP' is a "High Porosity" peat/perlite-based growing medium. This mix
ensures optimum growth, especially when high air-capacity and extra drainage
are required. It is ideal for water-sensitive crops, rooting cuttings and/or low-light
growing conditions.

I'm wondering if more perlite is needed.... ?
I'm under the impression I can go three weeks before I need to ad nutes.... does that sound right?
I've got some semi gloss white paint - is it an absolute that the paint must be FLAT white?
Now how what in the heck am I gona do about the heat? I though maybe the 1000w HPS is a bit over the top but I didn't wana bother with an upgrade in three months. the hood has one 4" vent opening..... but here's where it gets uncomfortable.... I have NO experience with vents or electricity. I guess I'd need to buy a can fan but what size? And then what? Is there a simple girly way to do this without breaking a nail?

So any opinions? Please be gentle....
 

2Dog

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I have started in larger pots with no issue..if space isnt an issue I say bigger pot = bigger plant. I buy my fans at yardsales..just regular ones. course some people here are very advanced at setting up systems. The light you have is very strong so u will have to be careful to not burn the babies...I dont give nutes until atleast 4 weeks. good luck other people will know more about space and lighting but I dont suggest fabric drape because it is flamable.
 

OldHippieChick

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Shoulda been more precise - was thinking a mylar curtain blocking off the
2'. There's a shelf and rod there. Could be an easy storage cubby area.... but do I really NEED to block it off at all? I think Hippy in England told me I needed 170000 lumins for my area and I though if I cut out the 10' sq ft I'd be good with 145000 lumins......
 

2Dog

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well in the beginning you could block it off and as they get big and bushy you can always move it back...
 

dirtyolsouth

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HI OHC...

Dirtyolsouthern hippy dude here... lol... Nice to meet you! A tighter grow space will help you make better use of your light. Do you have some ventilation in that 5 x 5 space to get the heat out of there? I use a 1K in a 2 x 4 x 8 closet and it takes a very strong inline fan to pull the heat off of my 1K that I have in a cool tube light fixture. Is your light air cooled at all? Do you live in the Arctic? lol... The cooler fall, winter and spring temps around here make it MUCH easier to maintain temps in the lower to mid 70's in my closet than it is in the summer around here. In the summer it takes LOTS of a/c too... Even in the winter I have to keep cool air coming in and pull the heat off of my light with my cool tube to keep temps right... So make sure you have some plan before it's 100º in there... And odor control will become an issue too if you don't ventilate. Even with ventilation you'll probably need a carbon filter if you want to keep your grow very stealth...

Anyhooo... glad to help and there are plenty of others who will jump in to help you on your way to dankness! Have a good one...

Peace!:cool:
 

OldHippieChick

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Hi you dirtyolsouth hippy :)
No ventilation - that's what's got me scared.... I don't know how to do ventilation. The hydrofarm reflector does have a 4" hole in the side for ventilation but what size fan do I need? I see all size of cfm(s).... how many cfms do I need? I've got my eye on a hydrofarm 465 CFM ActiveAir Blower System - ACF465 - but if I get it - what the heck do I do with it? I'd assume I'd run something similar to a dryer vent duct from the light to the fan and up to the attic? But the added heat to the attic makes me worry about cops. They are real proud of their heat sensors on their helecopters here..... venting outside is not such a good idea - it's brick. You are right - winter will be here soon but it's pretty mild in these parts and will be till Jan. thanks for your input - more welcome - OHC
 

chefboyrd420

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OldHippieChick said:
Hi you dirtyolsouth hippy :)
No ventilation - that's what's got me scared.... I don't know how to do ventilation. The hydrofarm reflector does have a 4" hole in the side for ventilation but what size fan do I need? I see all size of cfm(s).... how many cfms do I need? I've got my eye on a hydrofarm 465 CFM ActiveAir Blower System - ACF465 - but if I get it - what the heck do I do with it? I'd assume I'd run something similar to a dryer vent duct from the light to the fan and up to the attic? But the added heat to the attic makes me worry about cops. They are real proud of their heat sensors on their helecopters here..... venting outside is not such a good idea - it's brick. You are right - winter will be here soon but it's pretty mild in these parts and will be till Jan. thanks for your input - more welcome - OHC

ok. I just went through all this myself and it took a long time for me to figure it out and get everything the way i need it, so im glad to pass this knowledge on to someone else. If you want to see it in detail look at my grow room setup thread. A 1000w is a lot. about 147000 lumen is what mine puts out. Plenty enough for a 5x5 or a 5x7. Is your light setup able to be moved up and down hopefully? you def dont want it to close, but i find about 2' from the canopy keeps a steady temp of about 80F and it theres an equation for how much light is lost to the plant every ft somewhere in here too. I have a 310cfm inline fan, 465 would be better. I definetely would not take it easy on the cooling. That 1000w is gonna be hot and need some serious exhaust. If you neglect the cooling, youll be wasting your time because it'll be to hot and it makes terrible "hot spots" that the helicopters can see if you need to be concerned about that kinda thing. You need duct straps(large zip ties) and 6" ducting. Its like 20$ for 25ft so not to bad. pull the black inner liner out and zip tie it on the light opening. then zip tie the outer insulated liner over that, run it to your exhaust fan, then to wherever you plan on venting it to. Mine runs into the attic from a hole i cut in the drywall. The attic is naturally hotter so it doesnt look as obvious if its warmer, ya know? Plus i would assume if you run it to the attic itll be spread over a much larger area then your closet or room so not as noticeable. Don't forget though, you need two fans. Something has to push cool air back into the light or at least the room, closet, whatev. Both my fans are about the same size. I hope this helps you. If you have any questions feel free to ask. Ill see if i can show you my setup by linking it or taking some new pics, but my baby is sleeping right now.
 

OldHippieChick

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Thanks chefboyd420. I'd be grateful for a pic.... this may well be the most challenging part of this first grow for me because I am def out of my comfort zone. So does the fan/blower get mounted to the ceiling? I've looked at the pic of the product and checked out the specs on line but still cant see it in my mind. If I have to break this down into steps I'd think the cooling is first priority as I can open the door and blow in new air when it's on 24/0 lighting for the first three weeks. And where does the filter fit in?

And to answer the up and down question, yes yoyos.... the man at home depot thought I was nuts lmao.
 

chefboyrd420

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http://www.marijuanapassion.com/forum/showthread.php?t=38223

Heres my setup link, but i just took some pics anyway. See the black inner liner on the top of page 2 in the setup thread? the silver outside is full of insulation. my inline is hooked to the ceiling. it runs out of the light through the divider and into the inline. then out of the inline and into the attic. the crazy fan in the 1st pic is the floor fan that blows cool air back through the divider and into my room. the black things hanging from the inline is the duct straps. Oh! and i dont use a carbon filter yet, but i would hook it up to the exhaust somewhere between the light and inline or the inline and attic. good luck!! :watchplant:

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dirtyolsouth

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Hi again...

:yeahthat:

GREAT info from the chef! :rolleyes: Very cool... I flower in a 2 x 4 x 8 closet and I have a 1K HPS in a cool tube... before the cool tube I have a 40 lb carbon filter in my ventilation chain... So... the first thing in my ventilation chain is a carbon filter where all air is sucked into... then a short piece of 6" duct goes from the filter to the intake side of my cool tube... I come out of my cool tube into a 6" 'elbow' piece of duct and then a straight 6 foot piece of semi-rigid 6" duct to my 630cfm fan in the attic. I pull the air from the attic and the odor-free, hot air I just blow into the attic but if you wanted to you could run a piece of duct over to one of your roof vents and the heat would escape and look like your furnace or hot water heater running etc...

A 465 may be big enuf for a fan but you may want a stronger fan. I use an Eclipse 630cfm fan and it's a very powerful fan. I have no fan noise or vibration cuz I have it hung from rubber straps (near the bungee at home depot ;)) from rafters in my attic... The only noise comes from the w-h-o-o-o-o-o-s-h of air going through the duct. You could use insulated duct if you need to keep things quiet as possible.

Also... I don't know if you've noticed but many growers (me too!) run their day cycle at night when temps are cooler. I run my lights from 8pm til 8am in my bloom room. I only have to run my ventilation fan on full during lights on and when they go out I can run the fan at about 30% of max... just enough to keep air pulling out of my closet/room and flowing up and out of my attic... This keeps any odor from getting a chance to build up. If you don't ventilate or filter the air the stanky smell will slowly build up until it comes out of your grow room, goes down the hall and greets whoever comes to your door... I've been to rooms SO out of control that you smell it walking up the driveway... NOT good. You can buy a 'Speedster Motor Speed Controller' for about $28 at a hydro store or online that you can hook up your ventilation fan to. imho it's better to get a bit too much rather than a fan that struggles to keep up. Look around for a "High Output" fan more in the 600+cfm range for your 1K and you'll be much more diverse in your ability to deal with environmental issues year around in your grow room. The same goes for carbon filters... They are heavy and a bit of a P I T A to hang in your grow room (got any friends that you REALLY trust to help?) but it's the best investment I've ever spent in my 15 years of playing around with growing this amazing plant. No odor = no stress... Peace of mind... Get at good sized 40lb+ filter and stop odors before they build up. Carbon filters are the bomb as the kids like to say... lol... :p

So... just take it all in baby steps... Check out how other grow rooms are set up and what kind of ventilation they have going... Here's a couple of pics of my closet setup... you can see the filter and a 6" diameter, 15" piece of duct connects it to my cooltube... then it goes into an elbow and up through the hole in my ceiling... Dont have any pics in the attic but I'll try to get some if I go up there this week...

Peace!:cool:
 

chefboyrd420

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uhhh. jeez. that really depends on where you get the stuff. if you can get it all for $300 USD you did good. haggle. most the time the owners of hydro stores are growers too and will hook you up a extra deal if you tell them youll come back for your other growing needs. you would be fine with 2x440cfms. at full price like $150 each but you can get carbon filters cheap. so buy two fans and ask em to throw in the filter.:)
 

OldHippieChick

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So inline fans are not available in the industrial sector? The hydro shops in my area seem overpriced and what you are describing runs $500+. I feel a bit molested when I leave those places.
 

dirtyolsouth

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OldHippieChick said:
what is a good price and source for two fans 500cfm+ and a filter?
There are lots of good places online but you'll pay for shipping. Some local hydro stores have high prices but that happens less now that everyone can buy online... Do you live near an indoor gardening/hydro store? There are tons of good websites... I like to use greentreeshydroponics.com, Texashydroponics and horticulturesource.com as they have just about everything and some of the lowest prices I've found on the internet and they ship from many different warehouses around the U.S. Are you in a med mj state? Craigslist can be a great resource if you live where there is med mj... otherwise a trip to a hydro store or ordering online are probably your only option. When it comes to carbon filters, I urge you to look to see how close/far your nearest indoor gardening store is to pick one up... They are VERY heavy and would cost a lot to ship. Fans that are 500+cfm usually run about $200 but if you look online you can find package deals with a fan and a carbon filter and you can always call in an order and/or ask what kind of deal they would give you on two fans and a filter, shipped...

Happy Shopping!:cool:
 

dirtyolsouth

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OldHippieChick said:
So inline fans are not available in the industrial sector? The hydro shops in my area seem overpriced and what you are describing runs $500+. I feel a bit molested when I leave those places.
Sorry about the bad news... I know the feeling about the local hydro store. I'd probably buy the filter local to save on shipping and if they dont' give you a good deal on two strong inline fans look online and order a couple and you can probably still save $$$ even with paying for shipping. For two powerful fans AND a 30-40lb. filter it's going to cost $180-200 per fan and about the same for the filter... When you put that much heat into a small space it's your only hope to keep temps within range. What size ventilation holes are on your light hood? The bigger the better... 6" or 8" hoods, duct, and fan will be much more efficient at removing the heat off of the bulb. When you don't have strong ventilation the heat from the bulb builds up and the hood gets very hot and radiates lots of heat into your grow room. With a 1K temps could shoot up over 100º easily without ventilation... Even a 400w or 600w light would require ventilation but a 1K needs even more powerful fans to keep things in the mid 70's...

Good Luck!:cool:
 

OldHippieChick

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So what you are saying is about what I've found.... I live near one of the three you mentioned so will check it out..... thank you guys soooo much for the late night hand holding . xox
OHC
 

chefboyrd420

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dirtyolsouth said:
Hi again...

Also... I don't know if you've noticed but many growers (me too!) run their day cycle at night when temps are cooler. I run my lights from 8pm til 8am in my bloom room. I only have to run my ventilation fan on full during lights on and when they go out I can run the fan at about 30% of max... just enough to keep air pulling out of my closet/room and flowing up and out of my attic...

Peace!:cool:

Wow. I said my room stays at 80 and me being the pot head I am, have never done this. Seems like common sense, right? I even turn the thermostat up during the day to save power, but i cant sleep unless its like 73 so I have to turn it down at night. In the mourning my grow room is like 76 so......... next time i guess. I feel raped. live n learn.:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
 

chefboyrd420

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OldHippieChick said:
what is a good price and source for two fans 500cfm+ and a filter?
Im sorry for giving you such a low price too. I do kinda have a hook up at my store.
 

dirtyolsouth

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HI,

GLAD to help out OHC... yup... I'm a total night owl... WHO? me! That's who... Most of the stores these days can't overcharge like they used to for indoor gardening stuff... That's not to say a lot of it isn't pricey but at least now days with all the internet resources they know if they don't sell the stuff for a reasonable price that comes in around what it would cost online to buy and ship then people won't buy stuff there... Unfortunately there are a lot of 'snake oil' sales people who try to sell you all kinds of products you don't need... But if you go in there informed and price things out you'll do pretty well more often than not.

Your ProMix soil mix sounds pretty good but there's always FoxFarm Ocean Forest too... And it's $15-25/1.5 cubic feet bag but it is some awesome soil. That's not to say that you can't make your own soil mix but they do all the work for you... The difference between the FFOF and the ProMix is the organic amendments added to the Foxfarm soil. FFOF [SIZE=-1]consists of rich composted forest humus, sphagnum peat for aeration, bat guano, fish, crab, shrimp, and Norwegian kelp meals - and earthworm castings. There are even some oyster shells mixed in to insure a balanced pH.

So the difference between using each of these soils for your grow would mainly be in how much or how little you'll feed your plants from the nute bottle. To put it simply, the more 'hot' that the soil is with organic amendments, the less that you'll have to feed them from the nute bottle. The ProMix is a quality product and has some amendments and lime added for ph control but it doen't have a lot of added nute value in the soil itself. Some growers prefer to use less hot soil or soil-less mixes and give their plants all the nutes they need from the bottle... If you used FFOF, imho you would only have to feed your plants nutes every 3rd watering and then only 1/3 to 1/2 strength because they would get most of what they need out of the soil mix. If you used the Promix you would want to feed them nutes maybe every other watering or you could give them lower strength nutes with all waterings and the occasional water only feed to keep the soil flushed from any nute buildup...

So it's different strokes for different folks... I prefer to 'load up' my organic soil and give my girls water with little or no nutes from the bottle. I grew great bud for years with FFOF and gave them some feeding but in experiments I've had strains do very well in FFOF without any additional nutes too. It's a very complete soil mix...

ONE caution if you do go with FFOF is that it can be too hot for starting your seedlings in for some strains. Although most strains deal with it just fine I've seen FFOF give some strains slight nute burn when they are started in the mix. Seedlings have all the nutes they need within the seed for the first 3-4 weeks of growth. All they need is water. NO nutes at all for at least 3 weeks. Nutes will only cause problems and slow them down during their first 3 weeks... To make a great seedling mix you could mix something like Foxfarm Light Warrior 50/50 with FFOF to make the ultimate seedling soil mix or the ProMix HP would work well too... Once they are about a month old you can transplant them into straight FFOF if you desire and they won't need any nutes during veg because the soil has all they need. I always like to add chunky perlite at around 4:1 with FFOF to help keep it well draining throughout the grow. Soil can compact later in growth and the perlite helps keep it draining well. If you go with the ProMix it may require a bit of extra perlite too...

Seeya!:cool:
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chefboyrd420

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:yeahthat:

Keep an eye on me dirty. I could use your opinion quite often it seems. I use oceanforest and my plant keeps getting slight signs of nute burn and i couldnt figure out why. I check ph regularly and dont over water or use to many nutes. Im cutting the tiger bloom back to half strength today. Its almost time to flush it anyway.
 
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