veggging and flour lights

blondlebanese

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what is the best flourecent light for clones and vegging stage. t12 cool white, daylight delux, plant and aquarium? and will two 4' lights be enough for eight clones? is there such a thing as too much light?
 

Rosebud

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T5's for vegging. Brand new clones don't take a lot of light, i put mine off to the side of the T5 so they don' t get much light while rooting.
 
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Yes, there is a thing as too much light, especially for clones. Clones do not need much light at all. However, vegging plants need a lot more. You are not going to be overlit using T12s for vegging as they simply do not put out enough light for the space they take up for you to be overlit.
 

Sherrwood

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I have 12 4 foot T-5 lights in my veg tent, when I clone I simply put the clones on the floor of the tent under some canopy of other plants in just a bit of shade, too much light on a clone isn't good.
Also clones need fresh air flow as they have no root systems yet to support stress.
 

blondlebanese

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besides T12 4' cool white 40 watt lights I also have T5 32 watt 4' lights. so, I should use the T5's. is a two bulb light sufficient light? should I not place the clones directly under the light? I need to add these clones are being purchased from a clone bank more than likely the roots will be established.
 

Hushpuppy

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For clones that are already rooted and beginning to show new top growth, they are ready for full light. They only need the reduced light during the rooting process. The 2 bulb T5 ffixture is ok for just starting out with the clones but you need to get the proper lighting ffor them to have 3000-4000 lumens per sqft of growing space. If you have a place that is exclusively for the clones to get going, it should be enclosed enough to trap as much light within as possible while still allowing plenty of ventilation. The 2 bulb T5 is 32watts, that is not as much power as you need ffor the clones beyond 7-10 days. After that, they will have grown to a point where they need much more light energy. The High output T5 is what you need for vegging. It is a 54watt 4' bulb and will put out almost twice as much light energy. You will need a 4-6bulb fixture for a 2'x4' veg space, or a 8-12 bulb light for a 4'x4' grow space to get the proper veg growth that you want.
 
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I have never seen or heard of 32W T5s--are you sure that they are 4' T5s AND 32W?

Do you have a veg place set up yet? How large is it? That is what should dictate the size of your lights. If your space is not 4' long, you may want to check out the PL-55 fixtures. These are double tubes--basically an elongated U shape. They are 54W and put out 5,000 lumens. A 2 bulb fixture takes up a space of 12" x 24" x 3-3/4" and put 10,000 lumens. The 4 tube fixture puts out 20,000 lumens and is 2' x 2' x 3-3/4, so is geat for the smaller space or tent.

Hush, aren't the 2' T5s 24W?
 

Hushpuppy

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I'm not sure but I believe they are. I have seen the 32w 4'T5 in stores. They are standard bulbs(as opposed to HO bulbs) and often are in the 5000K spectrum (they call it "daylight" spectrum), which is almost worthless for growing MJ.
 

Spookyashell

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Sorry to keep nagging about this, you fine people have answered everything else I've asked about, except one of my questions.

For vegging would you prefer
23.000 lumens of 6400K (125W + 250W 6400K bulbs)
or
20.000 lumen of 2700K + 15.000 lm of 6400K (250W 2700k + 250W 6400K bulbs)

Option 1 has more of the daylight spectrum while option 2 has more total lumens, but less daylight spectrum.

What would you do from my options?
 
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For vegging you want light in the blue spectrum and that is the 6400K range. The 2700K lights are more in the red spectrum and better for flowering. Twenty-three hundred lumens isn't much for the 375 watts you are using. If you are having to buy lights, go with T5s--they will save you money on your electricity bill each and every month as (lumen for lumen) they cost about 35% less to run--i.e. your will consume 35% less power and provide the same amount of light with T5s over CFLs. Twenty-three hundred lumens will only light a space about 4' x 2'.
 

Spookyashell

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For vegging you want light in the blue spectrum and that is the 6400K range. The 2700K lights are more in the red spectrum and better for flowering. Twenty-three hundred lumens isn't much for the 375 watts you are using. If you are having to buy lights, go with T5s--they will save you money on your electricity bill each and every month as (lumen for lumen) they cost about 35% less to run--i.e. your will consume 35% less power and provide the same amount of light with T5s over CFLs. Twenty-three hundred lumens will only light a space about 4' x 2'.
Its 23 thousand, not hundred. And I will upgrade the lights later on. But ppl say the plants can make use of 2700k too, its just not that good.
Also my so called 375w only pull about 200W, but give 23k lumen.

Anyway until I get new lights should I go 23.000 lm pure 6400K or will they grow better from 20.000 2700K + 15.000 6400K

Thats 35.000 lm vs 23.000 lm although 20.000 of the 35.000 is in the wrong spectrum.

Also from T5 I only get 8.000 lm out of 108W , I get 8.000 from the so called 125W thats only pulling about 70W. So I would use more power for the same amount of light with T5, the ones I checked.
The CFL's I have are very effective with 111 lumens per watt. The T5's I checked only give 74 lumen per watt
 
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LOL--I meant 23,000--2300 would not even do a foot of space. How do you know they are putting out 23,000 lumens if they are only pulling 200W? These lights are not capable of putting out over 100 lumens per watt, so if the wattage is not there, I am pretty sure that the lumens have gone down in proportion (or more).

The 6400 lights are better for vegging. You can use 2700K lights, but the plants will have more stretch and less budding sites than a plant vegged with 6400K.
 

Spookyashell

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LOL--I meant 23,000--2300 would not even do a foot of space. How do you know they are putting out 23,000 lumens if they are only pulling 200W? These lights are not capable of putting out over 100 lumens per watt, so if the wattage is not there, I am pretty sure that the lumens have gone down in proportion (or more).

The 6400 lights are better for vegging. You can use 2700K lights, but the plants will have more stretch and less budding sites than a plant vegged with 6400K.
I know. I'm mostly wondering, will 20.000 lm of 2700K do more for me than 8.000 lm of 6400K in addition to the 15.000 lm of 6400K I will be using no matter what.
I figure since its 2.5x the amount of lumens will that make up for it being the wrong spectrum? specially considering they will still get the 15.000 lm in the correct spectrum.

Coz they are rated 15.000 and 8.000 lm and I used a power meter to see that the one called 250W high power CFLwas pulling 134-138watts while I messured, so I figured the so called 125W would pull about 70W. They are power saving bulbs. And I trust the shop I use. It has a very good reputation, they only sell the best bulbs available. The 250W cost 83 bucks and the 125W cost 50 bucks.

[ame]http://www.amazon.com/Feliz-Watt-Grow-Light-2700K/dp/B003EWDP5S[/ame]

Designed For Horticulture
Proven Success In High Humidity
Produces more usable light than HIDs (MH or HPS)
10,000 Hour Bulb Life

This is an actual 250 watt Horticultural Grade CFL. Rated for 10,000 hours and puts out about 15,000 Lumens. These bulbs have an internal ballast, have proven success in high humidity, And include a 6 Month Manufacture Warranty. This CFL grow light will only work with a mogul base socket. This CFL does not work, or fit, in standard household sockets.

This is where I got it, think its the same bulbs

http://www.designbelysning.no/vekstlys/grolys-hps-cfl-mh/250w-high-power-cfl-e40.html

Translated:
Place the bulbs 3-4 cm (1.5 inches) over the top of the plants
100% PAR in the correct spectrum for growing
Produce less heat than HIDS
Low energy bulb give much lower powerconsumption
High light output, yellow 20.000 lm , blue 15.000 lm
Long lifespan
 
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I know that a lot of these manufacturers claim that their CFLs put out more useable light than HPS. However in actual practice, they do not produce more bud. So my only conclusion is that this is just more of the hype we have always seen. Everyone is trying to compete with HPS, but in fact, when you get down to an actual grow, they don't.

That CFL is still only putting out 60 lumens per watt, which pretty much costs more to run than any other type lighting we use--i.e. the most cost per lumen of any bulbs we use. If they truly out-produced a HPS, this would be wonderful, but they don't. However, this is your grow, you should use what you want.
 

Spookyashell

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I know that a lot of these manufacturers claim that their CFLs put out more useable light than HPS. However in actual practice, they do not produce more bud. So my only conclusion is that this is just more of the hype we have always seen. Everyone is trying to compete with HPS, but in fact, when you get down to an actual grow, they don't.

That CFL is still only putting out 60 lumens per watt, which pretty much costs more to run than any other type lighting we use--i.e. the most cost per lumen of any bulbs we use. If they truly out-produced a HPS, this would be wonderful, but they don't. However, this is your grow, you should use what you want.
Not considering its only pulling 135 even though its called 250W, that makes it 111
 

blondlebanese

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all this talk of lums and watts is over my head. would someone give me the formula for watts to lumms. please. so I can keep up. in jargon that a simple man can understand its eight 54w bulbs = 64000 lums. is that right?
 
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